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Iran vs. Israel

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Would Iran and Israel nuking each other benefit Sunni Muslims?

No
9
64%
Yes
3
21%
I don't know
2
14%
 
Total votes: 14

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abdisamad3
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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby abdisamad3 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 1:52 pm

abdisamad3, its a stupid forum, i don't mind discussing with him as he isn't an arrogant kafir.


if the rafidah are muslims, why not the jews/christians/hindus, etc?
Christians jews and hindus..dont believe in Allah or say the shahada..so ofcourse they are not muslims..but shia are muslims..
and we cant exclude them out of islam..islam is not something we own..its from Allah to all humans..and if they comit danbi or anything wrong Allah will deal with them.. :up:

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby Grant » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:12 pm

Somali-Star,

It takes a Takfiiri to kill another Muslim. This is similar, but is seen in some circles as as a protection or promotion of religion, or of a political position perceived as religious. Haulocaust denial, blaming 9/11 and other terrorist attacks on Western governments, claiming that slavery, economic exploitation of underdeveloped areas etc., are exclusively western evils, etc. all fall under this category. They are semi-plausible lies aimed at protecting and energizing a like-minded base.

I am fully aware that most muslims do not practice taqiyya with the basics of their religion. But I understand even that has a long history among Shia who lived among Sunnis, and there are certainly modern jihaddi websites that deal in the political forms almost exclusively. The anti-Islamic websites are claiming it is more popular now that ever before.

I like the name Abu Taqiyya as I believe it explains a lot about Arabman's past posting history with me. :mrgreen:

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby ModerateMuslim » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:28 pm

grant,

defeatist moderate-"muslims" are the ones who do this kind of stuff, not us. they are an embarrassment as far as the muslims are concerned. :down:

abdisamad3,

we don't decide who's muslim or who isn't - allah swt does it. we only make takfeer of those allah swt and his messenger made takfeer of - failure to do so means that we negate our own deen. a muslim labeling a clear-cut mushrik a muslim = that muslim not being within the fold of islam any longer. so be careful. if i say that i've access to the unseen, contrary to what allah swt says, then you must make takfeer of me or you are out of the fold of islam, too.

p.s. shahada does not = automatic muslim. you must act upon it. worshipping, for example, a stone or claiming that you're a prophet from allah swt negates the shahada. etc. etc.
Last edited by ModerateMuslim on Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby hypereffective » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:30 pm

"Very few people know that the last messenger from Allah was actually an American citizen."

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby abdisamad3 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:45 pm

grant,

defeatist moderate-"muslims" are the ones who do this kind of stuff, not us. they are an embarrassment as far as the muslims are concerned. :down:

abdisamad3,

we don't decide who's muslim or who isn't - allah swt does it. we only make takfeer of those allah swt and his messenger made takfeer of - failure to do so means that we negate our own deen. a muslim labeling a clear-cut mushrik a muslim = that muslim not being within the fold of islam any longer. so be careful. if i say that i've access to the unseen, contrary to what allah swt says, then you must make takfeer of me or you are out of the fold of islam, too.

p.s. shahada does not = automatic muslim. you must act upon it. worshipping, for example, a stone or claiming that you're a prophet from allah swt negates the shahada. etc. etc.
Allah is the judge not us..islam is not catholic church where the pope can exclude people from christianity..
if some one claims to be a muslim we must take them on their words..only Allah knows what is in their heart not you or me..

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby abdisamad3 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:46 pm

"Very few people know that the last messenger from Allah was actually an American citizen."
what are you one of those NOI?

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby ModerateMuslim » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:04 pm

abdisamad3, we don't judge a person upon their heart but their actions or words. [fyi - emaan = actions/words/heart....to deny this = heresy.]

boy, you've much to learn. may allah swt make it easy for you.

start, insha'allah, with this article.....

What the Shi'ites say about their 12 Imams?

Dear Muslim Brothers and Sisters in Islam, below is some of the lies that Shi'ites say about their 12 Imams, as some of you might have already known that the Shi'ites are different in many aspects of Islam..... But I'll tell you that the Shi'ites are Not Muslims since they insult Islam with all of their superstitions and lies about their 12 Imams, here are some of the many things that the Shi'ites say about their Imams. (please read all the other articles on shi'ites on this site)

"All the Imams are infallible just like the prophets. The Shi'ites derive their religion from their immaculate Imams" (Ibid, p. 22) Well this is a clear statement of kufr from the Shi'ites, as you can see they admit that they derive their religion from their Imams, well this means that if a Shi'ite Imam made something that in the Qur'an was lawful, forbidden, the Shi'ites would follow their Imams... by this statement the Shi'ites have taken themselves outside Islam.

"By listening to the voice of a person, the Imams can tell if the person was destined to go to hell or to heaven; they would thus answer his questions accordingly" (Usool al Kafi, p. 185) Dear Brothers and Sisters, as you can see the Shi'ites make their Imams out to be some God-like being, can't they see that this is Shirk (worshipping other than Allah, or associating partners with him).

"The Imams possess all the knowledge granted to angels, prophets and messengers" (Al-Kulaini, Al-kaafi, p.255.) Well here is more shirk from the Shi'ites... How can an Imam, who is just a human, know the Unseen??? Only Allah knows the Unseen, and think about this... The Imams were not even Alive at the time of all of the prophets so here is a major contradiction in the Shi'ite faith!

"The Imams know when they will die, and they do not die except by their own choice" (Ibid, p: 258.) Now, this is a clear statement of kufr. Only Allah knows when a man will die! And these Shi'ites say that their Imams can control when they die?? This is major kufr and shirk for any one to believe in all the things that the Shi'ites say about their Imams!

"The Imams have knowledge of whatever occurred in the past and whatever will happen in the future, and nothing is concealed from them" (Ibid, p. 260.) Subhanallah!! Only Allah knows the future for any person to say that these Imams know the Unseen is committing Shirk and takes himself outside Islam.

"The Imams have knowledge of all the revealed books, regardless of the languages in which they were revealed" (Ibid, p. 227.) As you can see these Shi'ites have elevated their Imams to a God-like level, and the Shi'ites say that there is nothing wrong with this!!! Now can we see why the Shi'ites are different to us muslims!

"No one compiled the Qur'an completely except the Imams, and they encompass all of its knowledge' (Ibid, p. 228) So since the Qur'an was not compiled by the Imams then does that mean that the Quran is fabricated????? These Shi'ites want to even destroy Islam... look at what they say, they even insult the Qur'an!! And it is a well known fact that the Shi'ites have their own Qur'an (On this web site we have an article all about the false lies that the Shi'ites put in their own so called Qur'an).

"Signs of the prophets are possessed by the Imams" (Ibid, p. 231.) The Shi'ites have once again elevated their Imams to a very high level. The Imams they refer too are only human! So why do the Shi'ites worship them.

"When the Imams' time comes, they will rule in accordance with the ruling of the prophet David and his dynasty. These Imams will not need to ask for presentation of evidence before passing their judgments" (Ibid,p. 397.) The Shi'ites even think that their Imams can do what ever they want!! Here they say that their Imams can just pass judgment on anybody! And they say that their Imams will not rule by the Qur'an but will rule by the laws of David!! (All Muslims must rule by the Qur'an and Sunnah). This is a proof that the awaited Imam of the Shi'ites is not the one that Muslims believe in but he is indeed the Anti-Christ (A'war al-Dajjal). The one that all Jews are waiting for him.

"There is not a single truth possessed by a people save that which originated with the Imams, and everything which did not proceed from them is false" (Ibid, p.277.) The Shi'ites have proven themselves to be non-Muslims please dear brothers and sisters look at what these Shi'ites are saying, understand that the Shi'ites are really NOT Muslims!

Dear Muslim Brothers and Sisters, above is only a small fraction of what Shi'ites say about their Imams... their are many many Shi'ite books claiming the same thing as above about their Imams. So my Brothers and Sisters how can we call these Shi'ites 'Muslim' after what they say about their Imams, If a person worships Idols and does not follow the Qur'an is he a Muslim???? now the Shi'ites worship their Imams and they raise their Imams word over the Qur'an (they say that their Imams word abrogates the Qur'an), so dear Muslims make du'a that Allah guides us on the straight path and exposes the lies that the Shi'ites attribute to Islam, Ameen!

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby abdisamad3 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:16 pm

Somalistar..I never said shia where right..all I said was lets just concentrate about our true enemies..
we should let the shia mind their own bussines bro..I dont wish any war or fight with shia or sufi's..
we can debate with them preach to them and show them the right path in a peacefull way..
if you label them as kafirs and show them a hatefull face you will only make more damage to islam and to the ummah..becouse this division will be used by the enemies of islam..I hope you understand my point..

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby ModerateMuslim » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:28 pm

aslong as you don't claim that the rafidah are muslims... :up:

What Negates One's Islam

Shaikh-ul-Islam Muhammad bin Abdul-Wahhab stated, "Know that ten matters negate one's Islam. [They are:]

"First, associating partners in the worship of Allah.
Allah says,

"Verily, Allah forgives not (the sin of) setting up partners in worship with Him, but He forgives whom He pleases other sins than that" (al-Nisa 116).

Allah also says,

"Verily, whosoever sets up partners in worship with Allah, then Allah has forbidden Paradise for him, and the Fire will be his abode. And for the wrongdoers, there are no helpers" (al-Maidah 72).

Included in this category of deeds is sacrificing animals for the sake of jinn or graves.

"Second, whoever sets up an intermediary between himself and Allah, whom he prays to, seeks intercession from and puts his reliance in, has blasphemed according to the consensus of the scholars.

"Third, whoever does not consider the polytheists as disbelievers or whoever has doubt concerning their disbelief or whoever considers their way as correct has committed an act of disbelief himself.

"Fourth, if a person believes that some guidance other than the guidance of the Prophet (peace be upon him) is more complete than his or that another's judgment is better than the Prophet's, [then that person has committed an act of disbelief]. This would be like the one who prefers the rule and law of false gods [be they human or otherwise] over the Prophet's rule and law. This position is one of disbelief.

"Fifth, whoever dislikes anything the Prophet (peace be upon him) brought, even if he acts by it, has committed an act of disbelief.

"Sixth, whoever ridicules or jokes about any part of the religion of the Messenger (peace be upon him) or its rewards or its punishments, has committed an act of disbelief. The evidence for this is in the Words of Allah,

"Say: Was it Allah, or His signs or His Messenger that you were mocking? Make no excuse, you have disbelieved after you had believed." (al-Tauba 65-66).

"Seventh, the performing of magic [is an act of disbelief], this includes those magical incantations that make one love or hate another person. Whoever performs them or is pleased with them has committed an act of disbelief. Allah says in the Quran,

"But neither of these two (angels) taught anyone (such things) until they had said, 'We are only for trial, so disbelieve not [by learning such magic from us]"' (al-Baqara 102).

"Eighth, assisting and supporting the polytheists against the Muslims [is also a type of disbelief]. The proof for this is in Allah's statement,

"And if any among you takes them [the Jews and Christians] as helpers and protectors, then surely he is one of them. Verily, Allah guides not those people who are wrongdoing" (al-Maida 51).

"Ninth, if a person believes that some people are permitted to be free of the Law of Muhammad (peace be upon him), in the same way that Khidr was free of the law of Moses (peace be upon him), then that person is a disbeliever.

"Tenth, turning away from the religion of Allah, not learning it or applying it, [is also a form of disbelief]. The evidence for this is Allah's saying,

"And who does more wrong than he who is reminded of the signs of his Lord, then he turns aside therefrom? Verily, We shall exact retribution from the sinners"

(al-Sajdah 22).

"There is no difference with respect to all of the above whether the act is done jokingly, seriously or out of fear. The only exception is one who is coerced. All of them are from the greater of the dangerous acts and they are also among the most common in occurrence. A Muslim must be aware of them and fear for himself concerning such actions. We seek refuge in Allah from that which brings about His anger and the painfulness of His punishment"

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby ModerateMuslim » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:30 pm

http://www.islamicweb.com/

great site for the basics/fundamentals of the deen. :up:

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby hypereffective » Thu Jul 30, 2009 4:00 pm

Zionist Conspiracies Against Islam:
Rashad Khalifa's Cult

You'll find the most disastrous campaigns by Jews, Qadianis, Shia, and other enemies of Islam who say, "Just hold fast to Qur'an and don't follow Hadiths because Hadiths aren't reliable." Sayyidina Rasulullah (Image) forewarns Muslims Beware of the time when people sitting on cushions, relaxing, say 'just follow Qur'an and don't follow Hadiths'. In addition to the groups named above there is a wave of pro-Zionists propagating a false religion, but trying to use the name of Islam. These people may have Arabic (or Urdu/Farsi) names, dress half-way like Muslims, and use some Arabic terminology, but they are NOT Muslims, nor are they anywhere close to being Muslim! These shayateen are members of an international cult that calls itself "The Submitters," founded by a dajjal named Dr. Rashad Khalifa, Ph.D. The mission of this Zionist-backed organization is to wage an unholy war against Hadith and the Sunnah of Sayyidina wa Mawlana Muhammad (Image) while professing to follow nothing but the Holy Qur'an.

Many Muslims have heard the name "Rashad Khalifa," but few know the true identity of this wretch. The most interesting fact about this dajjal is that he was NEVER Muslim. Rashad Khalifa was a Coptic Christian from Egypt and when Allah sent that wretch to the Hell-Fire, he died a Coptic Christian (he was assasinated by a Muslim). His real name was Richard Kalif and he was registered as Richard both in Egypt and in America, but at no point in his cursed life did he ever become Muslim. In order to establish a cult in America and gain flexibility, the Zionists funded him to establish his following in Tucson, Arizona. He was paid by the Jews not only to spread his cult in America, but to produce his own (uneducated and fully opinionated) "commentary" of the Holy Qur'an, with the intent of levying an attack against Hadith & Sunnah and branding those Muslims who follow the Sunnah of Sayyidina Rasulullah (Image) as being "false Muslims" and heretics. Such an example of this is found on page 94 of his commentary, titled Quran: The Final Scripture, where he wrote:

"When they grow up in an environment that equates goodness with belief in God and the Hereafter, consequently this person may profess belief in God and the Hereafter; and in order to be good while in fact, his innermost convictions are contrary. [he then makes reference to the Holy Qur'an, referring to ayats unrelated to his feeble point] God teaches us in these verses that the invention of Hadith and/or Sunnah was designed to distinguish the true Muslims from the false Muslims. The true Muslims upheld the Qur'an, the whole Qur'an, and nothing but the Qur'an."

Of course, he means the "false Muslims" uphold the Sunnah of Sayyidina wa Mawlana Muhammad (Image). Keep in mind, Richard, alias "Rashad Khalifa" was a Coptic Christian.

In his own arrogance and filth, Richard claimed to be a Messanger of God, in the same manner the dajjal by the name Ghulam Ahmad Qadian did. In his retarded claim to Messengerhood, he declared himself to be receptive of revelation (revelation, which is specifically for the Prophets of Allah) and that Allah has revealed to him a "new Sunnah," asserting that the Sunnah of Sayyidina Rasulullah (Image) was invented by Shaytan. May Allah give that Coptic wretch what he deserves! The most popular of the claims of this false prophet is the fitnah of the "miracle" of the number 19. Though a very absurd and ridiculous claim the "Submitters" make, Muslims should be well aware that the "number 19 phenomena" of Mr. Richard and his "mathematical scheme of Qur'an" is purely his freemason insertions into religion. It is important to know that most of his statistics were totally false. Yes, like so many other cults, the Submitters are heavily tied into Masonic orders. In a very wasteful effort he and his cult followers produced many books in their pathetic attempt to support his ideologies with contorted "Islamic history" which is "coincidentally" written by Zionists whose aims are to defame and desecrate the name of al-Islam.

His cult now assumes new names in order to disguise their program. They now go by the following names:

1. The Submitters (most commonly used name by them as they replace ISLAM with "Submission." Since they know very well that REAL Muslims will undergo hardship and many trials due to the fact that they are Muslim, they don't call themselves MUSLIM, but call themselves Submitters.)
2. International Community of Submitters
3. The Submission
4. Qur'anic Islam Movement (an offshoot of Mr. Richard's group from Pakistan)

As previously stated, the mission of these kuffar is to attack one of the basic structures of Islam, which is the Sunnah of The Holy Last Messenger ((may Peace Be Upon Him)). There are numerous beliefs and assertions these shayateen make which clearly expose their anti-Islamic agenda and pagan beliefs. For example, 1.) They believe that Sayyidina Muhammad (Image) wrote the Holy Qur'an himself. 2.) They disbelieve the Kalimah's second half, which is MUHAMMAD is the Messanger of Allah. 3.) They reject many verses of the Holy Qur'an. Bear in mind that there is no difference between their beliefs and that of Iblis (Satan), because Iblis accepts the first half of the Kalimah (Laa ilaaha illallah), but rejects the second half.

No matter what state Sayyidina Muhammad (Image) was in, his blessed words were either revelation or in the light of revelation, and the Almighty Allah proves it to all of mankind in Surat an-Najm were He says:

"And he (Muhammad) does not say anything from his own hawaa (desires, wishes). Indeed he says what is revelation or in light of revelation."

Anyone who disbelieves in this doesn't believe in Holy Qur'an.

The followers of Mr. Richard Kalif, alias Rashad Khalifa (may Allah give that wretch what he deserves, no matter what name he assumed), are neither Muslim nor are they to be regarded as Islamic in any shape or form, for their only motive is to rebel against Islam via attacking Hadith, Sunnah, and the blessed personality of Sayyidina wa Mawlana Muhammad (Image). They come in the guise of people who strongly attack non-Muslim religions, but Allah exposes them for who they are by their own words, as they slide in attacks against common sense Shari'ah issues, such as eating pork or haram meat, etc. May Allah protect Muslims from the satanic rhetoric of this cult and other Zionist organizations bent on destroying al-Islam from the inside as well as the outside. Aameen.

http://islamicweb.com/beliefs/cults/submitters.htm

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Re: Iran vs. Israel

Postby rich-boy » Thu Jul 30, 2009 5:12 pm

wats wrong with this guy how would that benefit sunni muslims other muslims dying its not something that we should be happy about we cant judge them its betwen them and Allah even if what they doing is wrong is this what the muslim ummah came to wandering if the death of other muslims will benefit us it will affect the sunni muslims because if isreal go to war with Iran lebanese will get involve by that i mean the Hezbollah it would triger another civil war in lebanon

i always thought that the arabs couldnt fight but lebanese are warriors even the christians lebanese are crazy they help isrealis kill muslims lebanese and palestinians kids and womans during the war the sabra and shatila massacre they should be judge for war crimes


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