Lafoole 1896: ''Axad Shiiki''

[Murax]

[quote="RIIGHAYE"]It is in the history that W'adan and Biyomaal were under the influence of Sheikh Abdulle's Dervish struggles.

Somaliwayn, you are probably abridging history timelines and distorting what the history books wrote.

In the end, the winner writes history and it was Daarood.


Are Geledis Hawiye or Eelaay?[/quote]




Geladi are NOT Haiwiye. Neither are Biyomal. The case here was Muloduud's place in history not those two other patriotic groups.

[Twisted_Logic]

[quote="The-Screw"]i have no problems if the so called history you wish to discuss is actual history. what i have problems with is the obvious exaggerations and/or sometimes lies told to the unsuspecting and naive minds browsing this forum. my $.02[/quote]

Neither Somaliwayne, nor I said anything that we made up. The words come from a NON-SOMALI author. It is hardly our fault, if the facts don't measure up to the bed-time stories grand-ma told you :)

[sadeboi]

Twisted and Somaliweyn, I will even post here for you kids, now I dare you to refute what I have presented. No wabeey wabeey ok, I want sources to back up your claims, everything I wrote is provided with sources and its books you have used. Screw is right people shall not be mislead, and twisted your right to FACTS DO NOT MEASURE UP TO GRANDMA STORIES!

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
THERE SHOULD BE NO REASON WHY THIS SHOULD BE MOVED MODS ITS ABOUT HISTORICAL EVENTS AND NOT SANDBOX TRIBAL ARGUMENTS!!!!!



During my time away from the computer due to finals and things of that nature certain lads (Somaliweyn and Twisted) did not take the advice of Col. Xoogsade to hid for a week for the embarrassment they received in that topic, instead the resident buffoons started to 'wabeey' as usual. Lack of comprehension, basic Somali historical knowledge, and frustration (Twisted being the more pinky of the two "Pinky and The Brain") was quite evident in their back and forth 'wabeey' dialogue.

Lets take a look back at my previous statement of the mythical, "second to Sayid Abdulla Hassan," battle:
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Lol, its quite amazing how people love to spin stories. Somaliweyn do you think people cannot obtain the book and thus will take your word for it?

Page 65, Chapter Three, Italian Colonialism in Somalia:

"Within ten days he [Italian investigator Sorrentino] had determined that Lafole incident [the one our friend Somaliweyn speaks off] was neither the precursor of a general uprising against the Italians nor an Ethiopian ambush but an isolated case of action by Wadan tribesmen and the tribes of Geladi, who had been SPURRED TO THE ACT BY TWO ARABS FROM MUQDISHO. Upon closer inspection Dulio and Sorrentino discovered that Abu Bakr bin Awod, Filonardi's [Italian commander] interpreter, and a certain Islam bin Muhammad were the two Arabs responsible for INSTIGATING the massacre. THEIR MOTIVE HAD BEEN FEAR OF LOSING THE PROFITABLE POSITION THEY HELD UNDER THE FILONARDI ADMINSTRATION."

Page 66, Chapter Three, Italian Colonialism in Somalia:

"When reinforcements of two companies of Eritrean askaris finally arrived in March, the Italians completed their plans for the PUNITIVE expedition against the Wadan and Gedladi. On April 20, Sorrentino led his expedition inland burned Lafole and several other villages. The encounter with the Italians SUBDUED the Sultan of Gedladi, WHO QUICKLY SIGNED A TREATY OF PEACE AND PLEDGED OBEDIENCE TO THE ITALIAN GOVERNMENT. "

My friends this was described to us by certain lads on here as an epic battle of freedom fighters against colonialist, mind you, this was a case of use and abuse. Two Arabs, a mere two Arab men, outsmarted the wacdan clan into fighting the Italians because the Arabs were afraid of losing their interpretor job and wanted Filonardi to die so they can keep the job; reinforces the common Somali conception of "caqli abgaal" eh lol? Mind you, the mudulood clan never fought against the Italians before the Arabs convinced them to fight, except for when two Italians were killed by abgaals, when the Italians first step foot in Somalia by boat, after the killing of the two men the Mudulood and other clans signed peace treaty and that was it no more "resistance" [page 31 of the book.] Back to the "epic battle" that "sparked the longest resistance struggles in Southern Somalia" and which was "SECOND to Sayyid Abdulle Hasans and his darawiish," after the wacdan killed those Italians so the Arabs can secure their jobs the Italians took action to PUNISH the clan -- the word used in the book is quite amusing, PUNITIVE, see even the Italians thought they were used that this was not something they came up with and that they just needed to be PUNISHED so they won't follow any more people lol-- lafole and other villages were burnt and the Geladi Sultan, who is also the Sultan of Wacdan since they have an alliance and one sultan, signed a pledge and OBEDIENCE to the Italians.
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The more Pinky of the two, Twisted-Logic, 'wabeeyd' the loudest uttering things such as you are lying, and used the posts of Somaliweyn in a much more previous topic pertaining to the mythical battle, his tactic was; length, write as much as you can, copy and paste and do not make sense. Somaliweyn picked and chose his statements and used lines from different books and tried to make it one in the same by the way.


Lets view what Somaliweyn and Twisted derived from the book [Italian Colonialism in Somalia, BY Robert Hess] and the source of the mythical battle only next to Sayyid Abdulle Hasan:

Page 31

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f308/ ... talia1.jpg

Page 62

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f308/ ... ed-2-1.jpg

Those two lines where all they used to make up their story, but they never mentioned anything else Robert Hess said, and they went straight into another book written by Lee V Cassanelli tittled, "The Shaping of a Somali Scoiety," in which they pick and chose paragraphs and made idiotic statements as in this topic

viewtopic.php?f=250&t=153468&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=75

Now, in that topic they made it seem as if Lee's paragraph about Wacdaan and his description of "Lafoole Massacre" were one in the same. On page 208, you can see he is talking about "Lafoole Massacre" aka "Axad Shekki," and on the bottom you can see that he clearly states he will examine various groups who were with or against the colonial power, and he starts with the geladi clan.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f308/ ... alia33.jpg

One page 217, Lee starts to speak of Wacdan, its does not pertain to "Axad Shekki" as twisted and somaliweyn would have liked us to believe, remember he said will inform us of clans who were with or against the colonial power. This is what he said of Wacdan:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f308/ ... alia44.jpg

Anyone who held from Mahad-Moldheere, the clan that was first to show SUBMISSION to the Italians was known as a prestige person of Wacdan lol, this is the clan somaliweyn and co. want to depict as nationalist, the second dervishes. Lets go back to Robert Hess's book, our friends only provided lines and a paragraph from pages 31 and 62 and never mentioned anything else, when I present the other information in the book, and the real reason for "Axad Shekki," they cried and said nac-nac all day so I will let you lot see whats in the book yourselves and I want you to tell me if what I said in my earlier explanation of that mythical battle "only second to Sayiid Abdulle Hassan and the derveshis" as Somaliweyn puts it, is true or not.

Page 65:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f308/ ... talia3.jpg

Page 66:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f308/ ... itali4.jpg

I also presented some interesting facts in which Hawiye clans, including the mobileen and wacdan of Mudulood, pledged allegiance to the colonial powers and taunted the Governor so that he might attack Sayid Abdulle Hassan and the Biyomaal dervishes:

Page 90

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f308/ ... talia5.jpg

Page 91

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f308/ ... talia6.jpg


Lastly, I informed them that my clan of Sade were never subjects of Italians nor ever submitted to colonial powers and used evidence from Roberts Hess's book and they called it a fairytale, yet they highlighted sentences and made mythical epic battles out of it lol.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f308/ ... ed-1-2.jpg


After this, Twisted, as I have stated he is the one who 'wabeeys' the loudest presented the Baardheere Jaamaca v. Geladi wars as if it was Marexaan in that war. He also presented a line where it states a post in luuq in 1850 or 60 something to show Italian control over Marexaan not noting that Marexaan were not in Gedo during both of these times and that if he had a background of Somali History he would have known this, or even if he had read "Sufism in Somaliland: A Study in Tribal Islam--I, by I. M. Lewis."

[Gamadid.]

Somaliweyn, great stuff saxib. Very impressive. Murax and his ilk are bothered by the contribution of other somalis to our history. They seem very uncomfortable and keep wasting the topic. Dadkaan cuqdad kama dhamaato, mid cadaalad ku hadlo oo iyaga ka dhashay waa yar yahay, waana kuwa ugu roon qabiil ahaan markii loo eego, inta kale waa kasii xag jiraan. Wadaadadoodaa ugu roon, inta kale waa cuqdad miiran :)) Kulligood cuqdadaa lagu koriyaa.

Diin aan qabiil ahayn malahan. Waa dadaan ka warqabin nafsadooda oo tu kale ilaahay tusay. Ilaa ay toobad keenaan soomaliaya ma hagaageyso wallahi.

[Cawar]

" They seem very uncomfortable and keep wasting the topic. Dadkaan cuqdad kama dhamaato, mid cadaalad ku hadlo oo iyaga ka dhashay waa yar yahay, waana kuwa ugu roon qabiil ahaan markii loo eego, inta kale waa kasii xag jiraan. Wadaadadoodaa ugu roon, inta kale waa cuqdad miiran :)) Kulligood cuqdadaa lagu koriyaa."

Gamadid,

Who are you reffering to sxb?? MJs?? MRs?? or DRDs in general?? well dont exclude HG then...cos they seem to be from the same genre!! LOL.

[Gamadid.]

LOOL, Cawar, HabarGidir acts and looks like their neighbours. They are part of the problem. Soomaaliaya waxaa dhibaatada u keenay waa reer mudug saxib.


Saxib, look at the kids in this thread with the disablity to accept fellow somalis at some point in our history organized and fought colonialism. If it is not their clan that is being mentioned, it doesn't count. It clearly shows the deep rooted resentment they grow up with. People don't acquire cuqdad overnight. Xataa diinta ay akhrinaayaan qalbigooda kama sifeyso casabiyada. wtf.

[Alchemist]

[quote="Gamadid."]LOOL, Cawar, HabarGidir acts and looks like their neighbours. They are part of the problem. Soomaaliaya waxaa dhibaatada u keenay waa reer mudug saxib.


Saxib, look at the kids in this thread with the disablity to accept fellow somalis at some point in our history organized and fought colonialism. If it is not their clan that is being mentioned, it doesn't count. It clearly shows the deep rooted resentment they grow up with. People don't acquire cuqdad overnight. Xataa diinta ay akhrinaayaan qalbigooda kama sifeyso casabiyada. wtf.[/quote]


Well said..

[Voltage]

[quote="Gamadid."]LOOL, Cawar, HabarGidir acts and looks like their neighbours. They are part of the problem. Soomaaliaya waxaa dhibaatada u keenay waa reer mudug saxib.
[/quote]


Where have you ever seen Habar Gidir's name in Somali history and don't you think you insult people's intelligence when you say "well done" to something that has proven to be a false?

Just right above you is Sadeboi's photocopies of the sources that guy used, sources that have been proven to be dissected and misused in petty summarization. Yet you say "well done" when the exact copies of the pages are there in which Somaliweyn alludes to.

[Somaliweyn]

Finally they have decided to take part of the historical discussion. Good, very good.

I'll addres your points one by one.

FIRST can someone tell me why I get this message:

General Error
SQL ERROR [ mysql4 ]

Data too long for column 'post_text' at row 1 [1406]

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It seems like everytime I copy something from this topic or other source, I get this text.

|How can I deal with this problem? The-Screw?

Thanks in advance.




PS: About the case of the two arab men which SB and co use as argument, I recommend you to read Ch5 on page 5 titled: ''The Storm of the Resistance gathers strength''

I wanted to show how his argument was empty based, but the website gives me error. So in the meantime, just read ch5 on page 5. i'll clarify things later on.

[BABYGIRL123]

Many of our ancestors laid their lifes down and tasted death so that they and their children may walk this land as free men may they all be granted paradise amiin.

How dare a white man come to me and take my children away to go to a missionary school.
how dare a white man come to me and tax my farm and herd of animals and order me like a slave.

Death is better than life as a servant of your equal.

[Somaliweyn]

[quote="RIIGHAYE"]It is in the history that W'adan and Biyomaal were under the influence of Sheikh Abdulle's Dervish struggles.

Somaliwayn, you are probably abridging history timelines and distorting what the history books wrote.

In the end, the winner writes history and it was Daarood.


Are Geledis Hawiye or Eelaay?[/quote]

Without even reading this topic you come to such conclusion, what does that say about you and your views towards other Somali groups?

So just because other Somali groups were the first ones to start an armed struggle against European invasion of Somali lands, I am: ''probably abridging history timelines and distorting what the history books wrote''

Do you even read history? If so, you would know the timelines and understand that Sayyid Muhammed Abdulle Hassan came back to Somalia around 1895, and started his armed struggle in 1899. Only after 1904 came the Dervish cause to Benadir and Southern Somalia and were Biyamaal and other groups inspired by the successes of the Dervishes. But never were they UNDER the influence of the Dervishes, they only wanted to establish links since both were resisting and thus was it wise to bundle strenghts. Hence why the Biyamaal delegate went to Illig to start cooperate with the Dervishes and receive assistance.

So how can people who started their campaign around 1896 when Sayyid Muhammed Abdulle Hassan was still propagating his religious views in Berbera be UNDER the influence of the dervishes and their struggles, which were not even started?

[Somaliweyn]

''Somaliweyn, great stuff saxib. Very impressive. Murax and his ilk are bothered by the contribution of other somalis to our history. ''

Gamadid,

To be honest, Murax, Voltage, DS and the whole crew of the Red Berets have a long history of discussing with me in which they never seem to understand the point of not starting something you cannot finish. It has nothing to do with cuqdad on their side (I hope)...just an unfinished war on Somnet lol.

But your comment is right about most other people like the Riighaye dude. They are bothered by the contribution of other somalis to our history...and want to monopolize the Somali history.

[Shirib]

Viva Handab y Wacdaan

[Voltage]

Shirib, I am not going to lie to you. Everything you said was true except at the end the Geledi submitted like the Hawiye before them and also were anti-Diin elements (attacked the "Jamaaca").

I give mad props to the Geledi wallahi. Your history is powerful, you even ruled over all the Hawiye. The Abgaal imam was one of your personal lackeys.

You also ruled from Luuq to Afgooye for a time which leads me to suspect that the Ajuuraan and you are actually more kins then they would ever be to the Hawiye.

Being grouped under "Raxanweyn" really does not suit you guys. Why did you guys ever allow such a s.tupid thing as have your individual recognition be taken away?

[Shirib]

We did submit, but at the time we had no choice, came off two wars, one witj Biimaal and other with Hintire, and were under no position to fight, Suldaan Ahmed had to submit, there was no way he could of fought the Italians, especially when many of the other Geledi leaders had died in Biimaal wars.

Still many Geledi did fight the Italians, and Suldaan Ahmed wasn't even the most influential guy, he was fairly young as he had just became Suldaan, there were other elders who had more influence than him and did fight.

Baardheere Jamaca declared Jihad on the Geledi, they said Yusuf Mahmoud and the Geledi were gaalo and there blood was halaal.They were the ones who declared war. The Geledi are gaalo, but Biimaal are friends and allies. Biimaal ruled Marka, Biyooleey inn Marka is the biggest Siyaro concentration in the Somalia, but Biimaal are allies, and Geledi are gaalo and there blood is halaal. Yusuf Mahmoud was educated in religion and knew how to read and write in Arabic, something pretty rare then, but he's gaal, and killing his people is halaal. I will never understand the Baardheere Jamaca, I can understand if they were against, some of the practices that were performed, but they went about it the wrong way.

Rahanweyn are our brothers and thats how the story goes. These lines were drawn a long time ago. We are proud of what we are. Siyeed and Sagaal are just keeping the seat warm for me till I can make my comeback. They know who the real king of the show is.

Geledi do seperate themselves some what though. I learned what D&M was only a few years ago and I knew I was Geledi for a long time. I didn't know what Rahanweyn was till 2006, honest to god, I'm not makin that up. Geledi always just say I am Geledi. They don't call the language af maay, but rather af-Geledi.

Southern Somali history is Ajuuraan and Silcis, then Geledi. Geledi are king of kings, every clan in the south knows.

Biimaal used to pray Allahayo afar Geledi oo hashiis ah hana tusin. Looks like their prayer has been granted, but the day Geledi unite, we will become a force to rekon with. Mark my words.