BV Come in.. poll is homosexuality

[SultanOrder]

Seemeyer you have to know that these are legal systems, and all aspects have to be looked at based on their methodology. It is constitutional law, that is fluid and can change depending on the time.

Truie PO but I have heard Ibn Taymiya was a contraversial Imam even of his time.And that he was locked up for his extrme views is this true

From what I know he wasn't contraversial for most of his fiqh stances, but he was controversial for his Anthropomorphic views of Allah, and refusing not to let them go.

[ToughGong]

Seemeyer you have to know that these are legal systems, and all aspects have to be looked at based on their methodology. It is constitutional law, that is fluid and can change depending on the time.

Truie PO but I have heard Ibn Taymiya was a contraversial Imam even of his time.And that he was locked up for his extrme views is this true

From what I know he wasn't contraversial for most of his fiqh stances, but he was controversial for his Anthropomorphic views of Allah, and refusing not to let them go.

Yeah Wallahi that's exactly almost word for word how I heard it b4
He was Muctissilah sheikh in the time Asharicame back into dominance miyaa

[DR-YALAXOOW]

Source

When he was ultimately banned from having any books, papers and pens during the latter stage of his final imprisonment, Ibn Taymiyyah devoted all of his time to worship and reciting the Qur'aan. [10]Ibn Taymiyyah passed away while in prison in the year 22nd of Dhul Qa'dah, 728 AH

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibn_Taymiyyah#Death

[ToughGong]

Source

When he was ultimately banned from having any books, papers and pens during the latter stage of his final imprisonment, Ibn Taymiyyah devoted all of his time to worship and reciting the Qur'aan. [10]Ibn Taymiyyah passed away while in prison in the year 22nd of Dhul Qa'dah, 728 AH

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibn_Taymiyyah#Death

From that read he sounds like a great sheikh

[SultanOrder]

He was a Hambali sheikh in Fiqh but he interpreted the ayahs in the Qur'an literally, so his aqida wasn't in line with ahlul Sunnah Wa'l Jama'a. At the same time we do not deny the validity of some of his works that have nothing to do with aqida.

You have to understand that Ashari aqida and Matrudi aqida, brought nothing new to the muslims in terms of beliefs, but only reiterated what the the Jama'a believed in light of new groups that claimed other things, like ashari's were views specific to refuting what the Mutazilites believed in, and matrudi's were geared to some of the sects in the east. Yet even though these two schools of thoughts came up independently of each other and around the same time, to believe that they are different from eachother (other than in terms of sintax) is close to disbelief so I have heard from those who have heard from big sheikhs. That shows that the believes of Ahlul sunnah Wa'l Jama'a have always been congruent since the beginning.

[ToughGong]

He was a Hambali sheikh in Fiqh but he interpreted the ayahs in the Qur'an literally, so his aqida wasn't in line with ahlul Sunnah Wa'l Jama'a. At the same time we do not deny the validity of some of his works that have nothing to do with aqida.

You have to understand that Ashari aqida and Matrudi aqida, brought nothing new to the muslims in terms of beliefs, but only reiterated what the the Jama'a believed in light of new groups that claimed other things, like ashari's were views specific to refuting what the Mutazilites believed in, and matrudi's were geared to some of the sects in the east. Yet even though these two schools of thoughts came up independently of each other and around the same time, to believe that they are different from eachother (other than in terms of sintax) is close to disbelief so I have heard from those who have heard from big sheikhs. That shows that the believes of Ahlul sunnah Wa'l Jama'a have always been congruent since the beginning.

point taken

[DR-YALAXOOW]

From that read he sounds like a great sheikh

of course those who wrote on wikepedia about ibn thaymiyah ARE people who like him therefore they will say only good thinks about him, but if you read hes books walaahi wuxuu ahaa crazy becouse ibn thaymiyah said :- ALLAH is a body and he(ALLAH) has hands and fingers, SUBXAANA ALLAH
he said too allah sits on KURSI and prophets scw is sitting next to allah.

thats why he was arrested by 4 mad-hab judges and was sent to live in prison becouse of those blasphemous thinks like ALLAH is a BODY, SUBXAANA ALLAH.

[ToughGong]

From that read he sounds like a great sheikh

of course those who wrote on wikepedia about ibn thaymiyah ARE people who like him therefore they will say only good thinks about him, but if you read hes books walaahi wuxuu ahaa crazy becouse ibn thaymiyah said :- ALLAH is a body and he(ALLAH) has hands and fingers, SUBXAANA ALLAH
he said too allah sits on KURSI and prophets scw is sitting next to allah.

thats why he was arrested by 4 mad-hab judges and was sent to live in prison becouse of those blasphemous thinks like ALLAH is a BODY, SUBXAANA ALLAH.

The Culema can anly be critisized by other Culem of equal or more knowledge
Never the less I have heard his aqeeda was crooked (Ciwaj) and that he was locked up for it
But like PO said the Fuqahaa of his time actualy refered back to him in some issiues of fiq

We should follow the aqeeda of Imam Tahawi and leave it at that

http://alghazzali.org/resources/article ... hNotes.pdf

[SultanOrder]

I have the creed of Imaam Tahawi at home translated by Hamza Yusuf

Imaam Tahawi was before Imam Ashari and Imam Matrudi and all they do is just go into depth of certain aspects, that was relavent for their time.

[BlackVelvet]

Shirib, I get that there are 7 hells therefore sins are of varying weight however a sin is a sin, you either repent or will be punished that is my point.

^In shafici madhab it is not recommended to marry your cousin. I can't say anything about that tho.

I made further checks at that time and it is true

Imam Shafi'ee says that in the ayat: Forbidden upon you are your mothers and your daughters.......(surah nisaa) daughters are also mentioned. but by daughters it means those daughters who's lineage is confirmed from a man through legal nikah. but when a man commits zina and a child is born(in this case a girl) that child will not be considered his legal child in shariat, but rather it will be attributed towards the mother(if she is not married) and because of this, this child won't have anything to do with the father(she won't inherit from him etc).

In this instance because the girl is not considered as his child through confirmed lineage by means of nikah, she does not come under the ruling of this ayat and therefore the biological father is allowed to marry her.Imam Shafi'ee has took the shar'ee meaning of bint whilst the ahnaaf have took the lagwi meaning of bint. the lagwi meaning = actual meaning of word not the shar'ee definition. according to ahnaaf she does come under the ruling of this ayat.
(usool al shashi, pg 49, faslun fee t3reef tareeqil murad bin nusoos.)

please note this is probably just one daleel of imam shafi'ee from the many dalaail that he may have presented.

i'd just like to mention here that is important that we do not comment improperly on any imam's ruling without proper knowledge and understanding. these imams were pillars of knowledge and greatly accepted in the sight of Allah and the ummah, so please speak respectfully.

This is the craziest thing I have heard in my life.

[SultanOrder]

^BV, look at it this way when they say daleel, a lawyer who is trying to defend a murderer by using the argument of say insanity, uhm crime of passion etc. He is just presenting an argument if that case would appear of it's legitimacy but if it would hold in court is another case. If it would pass then it would of been setting a "precedent" for future cases. I hope that kind of makes sense on how you should see matters of fiqh "constitional law"

[BlackVelvet]

Not really, are you trying to say that the logic in that quote forms a legitimate judicial precedent?

[SultanOrder]

No, because to have a precendent it has to be successful. Daliil seems to me more like an argument for "a case". And if it holds in court than it sets a precedent. But I could be completely wrong. Allahu Calam I'm just trying to make sense of it too

[SultanOrder]

Dalil
Term that generally means “proof” but is not limited to logical deduction. Also includes reasoning based on analogy, called “proof by example.” For example, the world must have been produced in time because, like a waterwheel, it is composed of parts, and we know that things containing multiple parts were produced in time. Dalil also includes inference. For example, a smile is a sign of happiness; a woman who is smiling must therefore be happy. Dalil in natural science and law has an empirical aspect, whereby material evidence is required to establish the relevant claim, such as an experiment, event, or document.

http://www.oxfordislamicstudies.com/art ... =0&_pos=13

This one definition I found.

[BlackVelvet]

Thank you PO

But for such a daliil to exist in the first place...common sense calmly points out that were this to procede it would be incest of the first kind, incest I assumed was haram in Islam. But yes Allahu aclam, maybe it means something else that my eyes are not picking up But that word 'biological' it's like they/he already know without a shadow of doubt that she's his daughter..and that said shouldn't the father be dead anyway given that he'd be stonned for his extra curricular activities