Why is it hard for Somalis to adapt to European countries?

[Coeus]

I have noticed this in Scandinavia. Young aswell as adult somalis do not learn good Swedish , even though they have been in the country for years. For example my current neighbourhood has many somalis, one of them lives next to me. He and i spoke and he is from waqooyi so we had a good dialogue about education, repatriation and etc. He told me he came to Sweden in 1986 and he still needs a translator and he is on welfare because of his back is hurting.

Beneath my smile and constant nodding, i was disgusted by this man, judging by his teeth and his fat belly i was sure he probably both chewed and smoked too.

The somali mothers with their big hijabs are the only one caring for their children as nearly all of them i see are probably without a male provider in their life. The mothers grow frustrated with taking care of the children (food,clothes,shelter) but there is no one to help them with their homework, no one to teach them principals that they can abide by. And with the absent father, the childrens friend and teacher will be whoever they find on the street who plays with them.

And finally the youth, the male somali youth around my age, cannot speak correct swedish, they are mixing americanized ghetto words with pure correct Swedish. This keeps the male youth stupified and divided, since its either being wadaad or dubjir. There are problems, the ethiopian and eritreans do not have, but the somalis do here in Sweden.

So my question is, what is the recipe for integration and productivity within a community?

Ethiopians and eritreans are succesful in Sweden, because they learn the language, and they work and do not live on welfare.

Is there a difference in immigrating to first world countries in search of a better quality of life then the one back home, or having to leave the homeland out of necessety because living in a warzone is not an option?
Does the mindset the immigrant have already from the start, determine how good of an asset he\she becomes for the adopted society?

[Beenaale_No1]

Exaggeration.

Our lowest Somali is no worse or better than the lowest of Others.

Look at the Carrebeans in UK. They arrived before WW2 and look at the mess they are in. They are largely responsible for the knife crime epidemic in London. Thy have filled up the prisons - and they been there for several decades.

The Palestinians in Denmark are no better than the Somalis in Denmark.

Why do people always focus on the negative Somalis?? There are TONS who are doing good things for themselves & their community.

[XimanJaale]

Its the welfare that is making Somalis lazy. Just like our country is dependent on UN and co donations. We are too lazy to establish our country, everybody want piece of the pie (UN Donation).

If you go to countries like Italy and Switzerland you won't see lazy Somalis, they are all good at the language of the country and they all work. This is because there is no welfare there. Same goes to the Somalis in Asia, they all work hard. Welfare is what kills the Somalis that live welfare states.

Also Khat, is what causes laziness and uneducated Somalis.

[Beenaale_No1]

Its the welfare that is making Somalis lazy. Just like our country is dependent on UN and co donations. We are too lazy to establish our country, everybody want piece of the pie (UN Donation).

If you go to countries like Italy and Switzerland you won't see lazy Somalis, they are all good at the language of the country and they all work. This is because there is no welfare there. Same goes to the Somalis in Asia, they all work hard. Welfare is what kills the Somalis that live welfare states.

Also Khat, is what causes laziness and uneducated Somalis.

Thats why Somalis in African countries are doing well for themselves. In Africa its a dog eat dog world, and Somalis thrive in such environments.

[Coeus]

Beenale and xiiman

The habashi community doesnt seem to have these problems. Dont you think also awareness and more work sponsored by somali mosques and associations are needed to curb this fenomenon?

[XimanJaale]

Its the welfare that is making Somalis lazy. Just like our country is dependent on UN and co donations. We are too lazy to establish our country, everybody want piece of the pie (UN Donation).

If you go to countries like Italy and Switzerland you won't see lazy Somalis, they are all good at the language of the country and they all work. This is because there is no welfare there. Same goes to the Somalis in Asia, they all work hard. Welfare is what kills the Somalis that live welfare states.

Also Khat, is what causes laziness and uneducated Somalis.

Thats why Somalis in African countries are doing well for themselves. In Africa its a dog eat dog world, and Somalis thrive in such environments.

Yes indeed. Look at Kenya, Uganda, Tanzania, Ethiopia Somalis there are richer and more educated than those Somalis in Europe. Somalis only work hard if they feel like competing or if they are desperate.

[XimanJaale]

Beenale and xiiman

The habashi community doesnt seem to have these problems. Dont you think also awareness and more work sponsored by somali mosques and associations are needed to curb this fenomenon?

The Habashi's came to diaspora to work and get educated. They never came abroad as refugees or to feel safer like the Somalis. When us Somalis came abroad our mindset was to live in safe country and to get fed. This mindset stayed with us and we are not letting ourselves to re-evaluate what we can do.

Yes, the Mosque needs to help the Somalis to re-evaluate their thinking. As Islam teaches us to work and get educated. But sadly the moqsue only worry about expanding their building, and all they do is ask for money. The irony is that they are also begging. So they are no better than the ordinary Somali.

[Coeus]

Beenale and xiiman

The habashi community doesnt seem to have these problems. Dont you think also awareness and more work sponsored by somali mosques and associations are needed to curb this fenomenon?

The Habashi's came to diaspora to work and get educated. They never came abroad as refugees or to feel safer like the Somalis. When us Somalis came abroad our mindset was to live in safe country and to get fed. This mindset stayed with us and we are not letting ourselves to re-evaluate what we can do.

Yes, the Mosque needs to help the Somalis to re-evaluate their thinking. As Islam teaches us to work and get educated. But sadly the moqsue only worry about expanding their building, and all they do is ask for money. The irony is that they are also begging. So they are no better than the ordinary Somali.

I see, it will take serious will power to change this mindset.

[XimanJaale]

Beenale and xiiman

The habashi community doesnt seem to have these problems. Dont you think also awareness and more work sponsored by somali mosques and associations are needed to curb this fenomenon?

The Habashi's came to diaspora to work and get educated. They never came abroad as refugees or to feel safer like the Somalis. When us Somalis came abroad our mindset was to live in safe country and to get fed. This mindset stayed with us and we are not letting ourselves to re-evaluate what we can do.

Yes, the Mosque needs to help the Somalis to re-evaluate their thinking. As Islam teaches us to work and get educated. But sadly the moqsue only worry about expanding their building, and all they do is ask for money. The irony is that they are also begging. So they are no better than the ordinary Somali.

I see, it will take serious will power to change this mindset.

I'm always optimistic, there are more Somalis that are growing out of this mindset, we have more Somalis that are getting involved in the country they reside in but sadly they are minority. Majority of the people are still lazy, the minority needs to start raising awareness. But sadly the minority that work hard are self-fish and don't care about their fellow Somalis. (Xasad)

[Estarix]

Ximanjaale raised good points there, perhaps welfare is what inhibits Somalis to be productive and dooms them to that life of laziness, poverty and the cycle unfortunately continues with the next generation.
For those who say that Somalis are one of the more productive immigrant group is deluding themselfes.

[Methylamine]

it's more like, "why is it hard for immigrants to adapt to European countries?"

[sexy-kitten]

Why do people always focus on the negative Somalis?? There are TONS who are doing good things for themselves & their community.

Because they are sucked into the negativity that the media displays so they can only repeat what they hear/see. BTW, weren't YOU also disgusted by the Somalis in terms of multiplying or am I confusing you for another member?

[LiquidHYDROGEN]

Because of the geeljire mentality which is 'do as little as possible to get by'. We need a massive overhaul of our "culture" and get our shit together.

Look at this article;

Indians are most successful immigrants in US: Forbes
By: IANS Date: 2009-12-22 Place: Washington


Pepsico chief executive Indira Nooyi inevitably tops the list of what Forbes calls "Eight Indian-Flavoured CEOs" who lead US corporations with revenues of at least $2 billion as the premier business magazine chronicles the rise of Indians in corporate ranks in America.

"The chief executive of PepsiCo would be prominent no matter what. The fact that the current one - Indira Nooyi - is an Indian immigrant (and female, in case you've been living under a rock) makes her all the more noteworthy," it says.

"It's not a not a surprise that we're seeing Indians rise in corporate ranks," Forbes quotes Richard Herman, co-author of a book on migrants to the US, Immigrant, Inc, as saying in an article published Monday.

"Of all the immigrant groups coming in today, Indians are head-and-shoulders above others, and this is partly because of their English language skills and also the advanced education that many of them are bringing to the US."

"Despite these personal success stories the number of immigrants who are leading corporate America, Indian or otherwise, is still a tiny fraction," according to Forbes. But, says Herman, "look at where the data was ten years ago and maybe it was zero or one [Indian then]."

Future CEO candidates might want to look for a tough assignment in order to break through, he says. "Americans are having a tough time dealing with global diversity, Herman adds, " but just look at who was running the Tarp financial-rescue fund - Neel Kashkari"- an Indian-American who is now joining bond giant Pimco as a managing director."

Of the featured eight, Nooyi, 53, says Herman, is part of a growing trend where US companies are being created, or led, by foreign-born individuals who bring in something special.

Vikram Pandit, the embattled CEO of Citigroup, is the other prominent native Indian in the corner office.

"Prior to joining the ailing bank he was president of Morgan Stanley's investment banking, fixed income and capital markets businesses and cofounded and was the chairman of a hedge fund, Old Lane Partners," Forbes notes.

Third on the list is Kenya-born Francisco D'Souza heads Cognizant Technology Solutions, which outsources IT services for its Western world clients.

D'Souza, 40, whose grandparents hailed from Goa in India, joined the company in 1994 when it was founded and within three years had gone up the ranks to become director of North American operations.

Next comes Shantanu Narayen, 46, at the helm at Adobe Systems. The diversified software company's flagship Internet video tool is Flash.

"At least one top boss of Indian descent is plotting a growth strategy," says Forbes of Quest Diagnostics' head Surya Mohapatra, fifth on the list. Mohapatra has raised $750 million from the capital markets for acquisitions.

Also featured are Dinesh Paliwal of Harman International, Jai P. Nagarkatti of Sigma-Aldrich and Abhijit Talwalkar of LSI.

Paliwal, a native of the city of the Taj Mahal, joined Harman, a sound-systems company in Stamford, Connecticut, as chief executive in 2007. Prior to that he spent 22 years at ABB Group and set up its operations in China and north Asia.

Nagarkatti joined Sigma-Aldrich in 1976 as a development chemist, and after heading the company's scientific research business was appointed COO, in August 2004.

Talwalkar was appointed chief executive of LSI of Milpitas, California, in May 2005. Earlier, he was at Intel's digital enterprise group. He joined Intel in 1993 after stints at Sequent Computer Systems (now part of IBM), Bipolar Integrated Technology Inc. and Lattice Semiconductor Inc.

Source; http://www.mid-day.com/news/2009/dec/22 ... forbes.htm



Doesn't it make your skin crawl with embarrassment when the firts thing a F.O.B. indian does is get an education and open up a business while the first thing a Somali F.O.B. does is look for the easiest route to income Taxi-driving/welfare/ security guard etc.

[barakaboy10]

simple reason: we just don't want to invest time in learning the languages and cultures we find ourselves in. instead, we sit home or in coffee shops and talk or chew qat and nothing more. our lives revolve around doing nothing. we don't want to adopt. we are basically the most unrealistic people you can find on this earth. ask anyone of us and you get the same answer.---"i am not gonna live here for that long" so why bother!
the other problem we face is that most of our parents don't value education because to value education you have to have education and most of them don't. it is huge problem here in america and elsewhere. i know many instances where parents encouraged their children to work rather than encouraging and supporting them to go to college. it is unbelievable what some people do!

[Mckuus]

The initial Somali immigrants to the west in the late 80 and early 90s were relatively educated, while the recent Somali immigrants (post-2000s) tend to be the lowest of low of Somalia's society. If you export the underclass of any society elsewhere they will fail, and since Western nations can't send them back only more and more will come.