Postby The rebel » Wed Jun 14, 2006 4:49 pm
[quote="Galol"]Sir Lug
You speak like someone who was right there in Nejd and Hijaz and too kind and gentle to inflict upon us the details of the evil allegedly visited upon the `early Muslims'.
Sadly I have a strong suspicion your knowledge of the subject matter does not justify the implied wisdom.
In human history, times abound when myth, reality, propoganda and legend, objectivity and subjectivity merge into a haze of indecirephable maze.
But there are also times when objective historical facts emerge with such clarity that all agree on their basic, overall veracity.
And on this subject we know some facts; incontrovertible facts with perhaps only the minutest of detail open to discussion.
These facts include:
1. Muhammed and his group (in fact it was Hamza who was boss at the time) attacked and robbed at Badr. The aim was clear robbery and clan revenge(Hashemi vs Ummayad)
2. Muhmmed and his group attacked at Uhud. all above detail also applies.
3. Muhammed attacked without provocation, dozens of other towns, villages, religious groups and clans (read the attack on Khaybar)
4. Once he defeated the Ummayads, a bit like the HGidirs defeating the Abgals, he showed them cousinly diplomacy(man dakhala beyt abu sufyan fa huwa aamin..; La acbudu ma tacbiduun etc)
5. He then sent letters to Rome, Persia, Egypt. I think the only other empires he knew were Ethiopia and China. Why he didnt send them anything we dont know. All letters said the same thing: Surrender to me and my new idea; or pay Jizyah(baad in Soomaali).
6. Every attack after that was an attack not defense: Persia at Qaddissiyah; Syria at Yarmuk; Spain at Andalucia. Also attacked without any provocation was Egypt, Palestine, India, Sudan, Maghreb and even Ethiopia eventually despite Mo promising them immunity from Islamist agression for their protection of Mo's followers including quite a few of his wives. thank Jesus(or more rationally the mountains and the Portuguese made cannon) this hub of African civilisation was spared from the kind of Muslim barbarity now ravaging Jowhar and Hamar.[/quote]
I know he doesn't know anything about the topic but Hashimis and Ummayat were fighting over power not religion. because both were Muslims(atleast they were claimming to be a muslims)
The other point I want to clear it is : Prophet Mohamed(PBUH) never attacked. They were forced to fight (I'm talking Prophet's time not after his death.... because what happened after that was another issue).
Muslims like any other group of people they are allowed to defend themself and ofcourse spread their religion.
The last point "he showed them cousinly diplomacy(man dakhala beyt abu sufyan fa huwa aamin..; La acbudu ma tacbiduun etc)" This was Abu Sufyan when he gave up fighting and acknowleged that his power time is gone and there are new leaders...So he was like ' if you can't beat them join them'...so he join them.