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History of Southern expansion, questions

Daily chitchat on Somali politics.

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thegoodshepherd
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History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby thegoodshepherd » Sat May 16, 2015 6:05 pm

The main question I have is, why did Majerteen or Harti not expand south like Merehan and Ogaden??

Merehan live in Mudug and expanded to Gedo and the middle reaches of the Juba river, and Ogaden to NFD and Lower Juba.
I know some Harti went to Kismayo, but why was there no land based expansion south?? I have never seen anyone address this question.
:lupe:

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby xiimaaya » Sat May 16, 2015 7:17 pm

Stupid question

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby Bence » Sat May 16, 2015 10:46 pm

Maybe Harti are happy in the north.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby The`Republic » Sun May 17, 2015 12:29 am

Marehan moved in on the NFD like the Ogaden. The reason why Marehan are not in the NFD in great numbers today is because the British actively removed them.

Notice how the border of Gedo coincides with the Marehan border because the British made it the border after moving them back from Wajer and NFD.

Here is a historian documenting the Marehan "repatration" from the NFD by the British. He says the Ethiopian government was supporting the Marehan chief "Sheikh Hussein" because the Ethiopians considered Marehan hostility to the British as a first line defense of British encroaching beyond Kenya to the Ethiopian border.

Notice the British proposal of controlling the NFD was three ideas starting with the "removal of Marehan from the territory". Notice also what I assume to be Garre and other communities only promising to support the British if Marehan were ALSO removed from southern Ethiopia as well where their tribal kin were also pushed out by Marehan. Pay attention to how the British were trying to convince the Ethiopians o simultaneously to remove Marehan from "Borana" territory in southern Ethiopia while the British undertook the campaign to remove Marehan from NFD.


https://books.google.com/books?id=dascA ... CCcQ6AEwAQ


Here is a Kikuyu writing in a UNDP article about the NFD saying the Marehan were expelled from the NFD by the British for refusing to pay taxes and fighting the British.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... HbBIQlUd3g
Last edited by The`Republic on Sun May 17, 2015 12:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby original dervish » Sun May 17, 2015 12:33 am

I know the Ogadens were under pressure from Ethiopian expansion during the reign of Menelik.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby LobsterUnit » Sun May 17, 2015 12:49 am

Because the majerteens could not survive without fish.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby Bari14 » Sun May 17, 2015 1:07 am

In 1312 the second Garaad of the Warsangeli Sultanate, Hassan aka Hamar Gale ruled from Mogadishu and even created a permanent settlement that took the Warsangeli clan name but has since been absorbed in HY Abgaal.

I've also heard from cousins that are some isolated Harti groups living in West Africa due to early exile.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby thegoodshepherd » Sun May 17, 2015 2:29 am

The Republic my question is that if Ogaden and Merehan, who live right next to MJ expanded in the south, why didn't MJ follow them??

There are no gabays documenting this expansion, although it is recent. It is the most significant event in precolonial Somali history, yet we know nothing about it

I know about NFD and how Merehan used to live in Wajir district untill kicked out by the British. Mostly due to Merehan supporting the Dervishes.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby Grant » Sun May 17, 2015 8:19 am

http://blog.crisisgroup.org/africa/2013 ... n-somalia/

"Q. Who are the Jubalanders?

Though Jubaland includes Gedo and Middle Juba, control of Lower Juba and Kismayo port is the biggest prize. Kismayo city is cosmopolitan, but the dominant clans are Darod/Harti (long-term “immigrants” from present-day Puntland and Somaliland), Darod/Marehan (more recent immigrants from central Somalia and Gedo) and miscellaneous Hawiye communities. Areas outside Kismayo are predominantly inhabited by Darod/Ogaden clans – also present in neighbouring northeast Kenya and southeast Ethiopia – as well as Jareer (also know as Bantu), some Mirifle (collectively known as Rahanweyn), Awramleh (a small Irir clan) and Galja’al and Sheekhal (often included as Hawiye). The Bajuni (a Swahili speaking group) inhabit the coastal districts near the Kenya border. The city of Jamame – still under the control of the jihadist Al-Shabaab group – is seen as the home of Bimal (Dir), Jareer and mixed Hawiye groups."

You will notice that the Darood/Harti are the first group named in this description of Jubalanders. I was neighbors with several Cumar Maxamud in Jilib in the 60's and had understood the Harti were well represented at Merere. Are you sure the story just hasn't been told?

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby The`Republic » Sun May 17, 2015 11:17 pm

Grant-

That's a modern day summary of Kismaayo by the Crisis group with many influences including the heavy Harti/Majerten migration to the city in the 60's although there were older settler populations.

What Shepard was talking about was the territory in historical population movement spanning hundreds of years where two Darod clans, Ogaden and Marehan essentially took over the country lands considered the southern third of the Somali pppulated lands deep into Kenya.

Shepard-

Majerten traders did migrate to Kismaayo area, but as for whole scale population movement like the Marehan and Ogaden, I am assuming the reason might be MR/OG were more nomadic and migratory whereas Majerten and Harti were more coastal and therefore sedentary.

I do know that Luuq used to contain as much Dhulbahante as Marehan precolonial times and many Dhulbahante are represented throughout the NFD in Isiolo. It is interesting that Dhullo were probably fleeing the Dervish wars though.

P.s. The town of "Beled-Xaawo" was started by Marehan and Majerten, one of the families fleeing the British expulsion in the NFD.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby STARKAST » Mon May 18, 2015 5:08 pm

The reer Guri (reer talxe/reer axmed etc) of MX helped for southern settlement to Gedo and then after that the central Som MX followed moving to also NFD and then further to 'JB'. Dervish wars also helped this southern migration. Harti as a northern unit didn't really have this initial early large scale emigration movement to 'JB'/south hence them staying in togdheer to central/south Som. Then they went to kismaayo etc. There are probally more reasons too like harti being more northern and coastal and had their ports to govern like Hobyo, las khoray etc and were less dependent on pastoral movements.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby sadeboi » Mon May 18, 2015 11:09 pm

The reer Guri (reer talxe/reer axmed etc) of MX helped for southern settlement to Gedo and then after that the central Som MX followed moving to also NFD and then further to 'JB'. Dervish wars also helped this southern migration. Harti as a northern unit didn't really have this initial early large scale emigration movement to 'JB'/south hence them staying in togdheer to central/south Som. Then they went to kismaayo etc. There are probally more reasons too like harti being more northern and coastal and had their ports to govern like Hobyo, las khoray etc and were less dependent on pastoral movements.
Reer Ahmed are galti not guri. The reer guri are clans like reer hassan, talxe, hawrarsame, soonfure, uurmidig, haber yaquub these are older tribes within Marexaan, the Galti are all from the Maxamed-Daud branch (equivilent in age to maxamoud salebaan and maxamed zubeer) this includes Cali Dheere, Reer Garaad, Reer Yusef, Ina Nuur, and the Xuseen Yusef branchs such as Cali Xuseen, Reer Axmed, and Reer Farax Ugaas. The reer guri moved down south about a hundred years after Amir Nuurs death and fall of Harer. The Galti came in two waves, some before the Dervishes to help out reer guri kick out boran and oromo, and some during the colonial era as dervishes and aid to Marexaan in campaigns against the colonialist.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby STARKAST » Tue May 19, 2015 4:10 pm

Thanks, Ahmed is indeed galti. In the early 19th century Reer Guri paved the way for the rest. By the end of 19th century thanks to Ugaas Xirsi and the clans who followed him, MX became a force in the south and had a heavy presence. Further on in the early 20th century, due to the British meddling in the affairs across the border and afar, more central MX migrated to help the tol, hence boosting their numbers to what we see today where effectively MX being southern where before they lived in the north. Cali Xuseen also helped cement MX dominance in Gedo.
Harti didn't really have such a dramatic chain of events in the south that brought them here in such large numbers hence them staying mostly in ssc ila central regions and galbeed and then the south.

Another pertinent question is the reason for the lack of MJ in Sanaag et al.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby BestPlaya » Fri Jul 14, 2017 10:09 am

The first Majeerten clans that settled Kismayo were lssa Mahamud and Ali Saleeban.They were mainly traders who dominated Kismayo town in the early 1900s with their experience in coastal life.The main reason they came deep south was to escape the brutal campaign of Mad Mullah against the Majeerten clans in Bari and Nugaal most notably the incident of ilig Daldala.Why they didn't expanded ? well,l think they were contended with having firm grip on Kismayo!

On the other hand,The Ogaden clans who were mainly Geeljire from eastern Ethiopia waged a brutal and decisive war against the Gaalmadow(Boran and Wardey) until the British stopped them from their holy land grabbing from the Gaalo Madow in the famous Aulihan-British war .This war is well documented 8-) .

Marehan ree Guri (Ree Xasan,Talxe HawraarSame) were first welcomed by Raxaweyn into Gedo.New waves of Galti Marehan came from Mudug and wardheer (Elidhere,Ree Axmad,Ree Faarax Ugaas) .The Galti Marehan not only dominated the Raxaweyn of Gedo but also pushed and conquered new territories in NFD from Garre ,Murule and Borana.But Marehan days in NFD were numbered since the British exiled them back to Gedo.

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Re: History of Southern expansion, questions

Postby BosasoShaam » Sun Jul 16, 2017 9:36 am

Actually to my knowledge Ogaden original homeland was what is called today somaliland as the isaaq on that time lived on the coastal between maydh and saylac.

The only reason for Ogaden to expand is looking for greenery as they were nomads camel herders and also warriors who took Oromo lands by force.

As for Mareexaan settling in Gedo was a Project laid by the late President of Somalia Siyaad Barre.

The Mareexaan moved from the north to mudug and eventually they landed in galgaduud.

As for Harti, we still roaming in the ancient Homeland of Darod (Sanaag,Sool,Bari) but that didn't stop us to venture more to the south especially Jubaland, as we all know the first settlers in Kismaayo were Harti, Daarood.


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