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Apparently "Puntland controls cities and towns only within 40 miles of Somaliland's capital Hargeisa."

Daily chitchat on Somali politics.

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DatBreh
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Apparently "Puntland controls cities and towns only within 40 miles of Somaliland's capital Hargeisa."

Postby DatBreh » Sun Jul 24, 2016 8:04 pm

You have to hand it to these guys, from taking over Wikipedia and turning it into cesspool of anti-Somaliland propaganda and pro anything D-block, it seems nowhere on the internet is safe.

Here's a a couple of posts on a Reddit thread about the many emerging Somali bookfairs popping up

Someone says -
It's a pity "North Somalia" wasn't recognized and legitimized as a "sovereign nation" all those years ago the way "South Sudan" was recently. The difference? South Sudan has oil and is Christan.

Also, the international community at large didn't give two figs that Puntland, North Somalia (formerly British) and South-East Somalia (lawless Mogadishu and formerly Italian) worked better separately.
The response
I'm from northern Somalia, and I can guarantee that the vast majority of Somalis in the north are staunchly against secession.

There is virtually no difference between the "north" and "south" as they are all ethnic Somalis who speak the same language and (mostly) speak the same dialect, have the same religion, the same nomadic camel herding lifestyle, and single homogenous culture and ancestry. The whole 'Italian' vs 'British' is the most fake and false reasoning for succession and conflict in Somalia, as the whole basis of conflict and succession has to do with 'clan' and nothing whatsoever to do with Italians or Brits, especially knowing how the British literally ignored their protectorate and left it almost virtually pristine without any of their legacy or influence to be found. Both British and Italian colonialism in Somalia had almost no effect whatsoever on a overwhelmingly nomadic populace who had little care for any borders and who only cared about and were only too preoccupied with Somali clan politic, not the British or Italian colonists who only worked to accommodate the Somali populace for the most part and made sure to not involve themselves with Somali society. The Italians only surpassing the British in this respect by managing to demolish a large part of Mogadishu's old city and building a single damned arch and church which are now referred to as 'the huge Italian colonial legacy' and 'Mogadishu's Italian feel'. I can barely tell you 5 words of Italian origin (or even a single one atm) in the entire Somali language.

Also, this whole 'Somaliland' thing and 'northern succession' has no basis whatsoever in reality. The 'north' has virtually all the Somali clans that live in the 'south', all this Somaliland talk has to do with a specific clan, the Isaaq, who happen to have a grudge against the larger Darod clan because of Siad Barre and the civil war. The sad fact is that the majority of the north is Darod, and half of Somaliland's territory is out of its control because it is inhabited by Darod clans and also several Dir clans who are both against succession and are very pro-union. This is not considering Puntland which is located in the northeast and rules more of the 'north' than Somaliland. And to only show your ignorance, Puntland is extremely pro-union and for a united Somalia. I know this because my family is from there.

The fact is, at the end of the day, 4 of the big 5 Somali clans and all non-Somali Bantu and Arab/Persian minorities are very pro-union and against any notion of an independent Somaliland. And even amongst the Isaaq clan, many sections are also against succession. This whole Somaliland thing is a continuation of Somali clan conflict, something that has subsided for the most part and some groups within the Isaaq clan wish to continue by forming their clan-based state.

And it's interesting to notice how 'Somaliland' has 2 pro-union and anti-Somaliland anti-succession Somali federal states within its borders - the eastern Awdal State of Somalia, and the western Sanaag/Maakhir/Khatumo State of Somalia. It also doesn't help that Puntland controls cities and towns only within 40 miles of Somaliland's capital Hargeisa. Somaliland's area of actual governance and control is literally shaped like a linear plot squeezed between pro-union Awdal and Khatumo/Puntland, a very small portion (1/5th or 1/6th) of the 'northern Somalia' they claim to represent.

And seriously? Puntland and almost half of northern Somalia was under Italian control, not just 'the south-east' - speaking of which, doesn't that leave the whole of central and south-west Somalia to someone else? Did you not happen to see a map of Italian Somaliland?

Also something of interest for you to know is when British Somaliland, upon gaining independence 5 days prior to Italian Somaliland's independence and becoming the independent and sovereign 'State of Somaliland', opted to forsake its independence and nationhood to join and merge with Italian Somaliland upon its independence on July 1st, forming the Somali Republic with its symbolic 5 pointed white star emblazoned on a blue flag, a star with each point representing a traditionally Somali-inhabited territory of Greater Somalia, respectively British Somaliland, French Somaliland (Djibouti), Italian Somaliland, Kenya's Northern Frontier District (NFD), and the Ogaden (now 'Somali Region') of Ethiopia. Clearly something was different back then in the 50's and 60's and up until the early 90's when the Isaaq clan actively pursued and pushed a pan-Somali and unionist 'Greater Somalia' agenda, in comparison with some present Isaaq clan members and their successionist Somaliland, this difference and reversal in attitude stemming from Siad Barre's bloody suppression of all clans (virtually every Somali clan) opposed to his rule, and the later clan conflict/civil war that exploded in the early 1990's. However, unlike the claim by Somaliland seperatists and the cliche 'founding principle' of the Somaliland successionist movement, Siad Barre did not only exclusively target and massacre their own Isaaq clan, as the man had even targeted his very own Darod clan and caused a deliberate man-made starvation by destroying wells in northeast (present-day Puntland) and central Somalia so that rebellious lineage groups within his own Darod clan would starve to death, with tens of thousands of Darod dying of thirst, not to mention the rapes and massacres he carried out on them as well. The Hawiye clan in central and southern Somalia were also bloodily massacred and attacked by Siad Barre directly leading to his toppling after having alienated, targeted, and massacred all the big three (Isaaq, Hawiye, Darod) Somali clans. So if everyone were to use the reasoning of these successionist Isaaq clan members, every Somali clan would set up its own successionist movement and clan-state/country - something that is virtually impossible seeing as how almost every clan is located in almost every other area of the country and Greater Somalia.

I am certain you are not Somali, judging by the sheer ignorance in this comment.
Probably the same guy who edits the Somali Wiki pages

Full thread

https://www.reddit.com/r/books/comments ... mps_up_as/

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balwarama
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Re: Apparently "Puntland controls cities and towns only within 40 miles of Somaliland's capital Hargeisa."

Postby balwarama » Mon Jul 25, 2016 1:39 am

the second post could be the only obstacle in some Isaaq clan members path of realising their dream of an internationally recognised sovereign state, where they could insualte themselves to play their Habar on Habar game. It is really very articulate and very simple to read and understand, specially for a foreigner!

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Re: Apparently "Puntland controls cities and towns only within 40 miles of Somaliland's capital Hargeisa."

Postby BosasoShaam » Mon Jul 25, 2016 1:42 am

And what is your problem?

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Re: Apparently "Puntland controls cities and towns only within 40 miles of Somaliland's capital Hargeisa."

Postby LiquidHYDROGEN » Mon Jul 25, 2016 4:41 am

:lol: Datbreh, you beat me to it. I read that REDDIT post the other day and burst into laughter. The amount of xaar and Dooro propaganda on the internet is amazing. If only they dedicated the same amount of time and effort to useful endeavours. Even in a thread that has nothing to do with SL/Isaaq, they will find a way to bring us up. :pac:

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Re: Apparently "Puntland controls cities and towns only within 40 miles of Somaliland's capital Hargeisa."

Postby xiimaaya » Mon Jul 25, 2016 10:09 am

:lol: Datbreh, you beat me to it. I read that REDDIT post the other day and burst into laughter. The amount of xaar and Dooro propaganda on the internet is amazing. If only they dedicated the same amount of time and effort to useful endeavours. Even in a thread that has nothing to do with SL/Isaaq, they will find a way to bring us up. :pac:

I noticed isaaq suck in online propaganda and virtually are no show where hawiye and darood of have plenty oiled machines like the Chinese hackers .


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