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Poor Bendover gets utterly frustrated .Your gibberish and womenish words absolutely mean nothing to me .It just shows how stupid you areI would rather take the word of esteemed scholars who spent years studying languages and dialects and actually conducting extensive research and field-work than a random drooling cagdheer on an internet forum. It is unfortunate that you've not had the chance to get a good education, you clearly do not comprehend academic methodology.
I think you have a fundamental comprehension problem. That or you are just playing semantics.
We are talking about the prevalence of Waaqo in both your abtirsi, as well as naming conventions within your territory. There is no argument about this; it is not up for debate. Instead, you choose to claim that I said only Isaaq are Somalis, and then attack your own strawman.
"Other clans may have assimilated groups that have some Waaq references, that is entirely possible, those groups with Waaq in their abtirsi are definitely Somalised Oromo whose ancestry worshipped the Oromo Sky God Waaq. The prevalence of Waaq in your Dararod leaves little room for doubt. Do not attempt to obfuscate Waaqism, it is a well established and researched Oromo spiritual system. You should embrace your Oromo heritage, not run away from it."
Some clans may have assimilated certain groups from the Waaqo-worshipping Oromo, this much is entirely plausible, but to have both Waaqo presence in your abtirsi, as well as used in naming your villages/towns make the case clear for your people. There probably are non Somalised segments within your Darod, but this would require further investigation to ascertain.
It is hilarious that whenever you Darods get karbashed by Duriyada, you run to hide behind other Somalis
With regards to your daft point re: Habar Xabuusheed, you really are not doing the reputation of your clan as being dimwits any favours here. Xabuusheed is a uterine grouping, there is no Xabuusheed in our abtirsi.
That has to be the stupidest comment you've ever made.
Your problem is you are uneducated, and still foolishly want to argue with people who are more learned instead of putting your time/efforts into gaining a deeper understanding of the subject matter. It is why you are often humiliated on these forums.
Saying ignorant shit like "Theirs nothing called Northern dialect which is exclusive to Ciise ,Iidoor and Gadabuursi" just shows your complete ignorance. Even a jaahil would not make such statement, simply because Northern Somali being an actual dialect grouping is a well known and published fact.
Whatever it is you said above, you probably pulled out of your arse. No sources, no documentation, no unbiased assessment needed, waa wax aad jeebka kala soo baxday.
Alright, class is in session.
The most extensive research on the subject of Somali dialects is Marcello Lamberti's 'Die Somali-Dialekte' (The Somali Dialects), a comparative study of Somali dialects. This is the only systematic actual field study of Somali dialects of such scale to be conducted by an expert. Lamberti studied 52 different dialect variants.
Lamberti divides the Somali dialects into the following groups:
(1) The Northern Somali (Nsom.), which supplied the official language of the Somali Democratic Republic.
(2) The Benaadir dialeccts (Ben.), which are spoken along the coast of Southern Somalia.
(3) The Ashraaf dialects (Ash.), which are spoken only in Mogadishu's Shangaani quarter adn in the district of Merka.
(4) The May dialects, which are the usual medium of the former Upper Juba, of lower Shabeelle and partially of Lower Juba
(5) The Digil dialects, which are scattered here and there all over the May-speaking territory.
Of these we are interested in the Northern Somali dialects. This dialect grouping is the one spoken by most Somalis and supplies the official language of the Somali Democratic Republic:
The Northern Somali dialects further subdivide into three subgroups:
(1) Northern Somali in its proper sense: spoken in the regions of Woqooyi Galbeed, Togdheer, Sanaag and Western Nugaal [before the creation of Sool]. The dialects belonging to this group are called Af-Ciise, Af-Geedabuursi, Af-Isaaq and partially Af-Warsangeli and Af-Dolbohaante;
(2) The Daarood group: spoken in the regions Bari, Nugaal, Mudug, in Western Somalia (Soomaali Galbeed) and along the Ethiopian border in the regions Galgaduud, Bakool and Gedo. This is the Somalia dialectal group which present the greatest number of speakers. The dialects of this group are the North-Eastern dialects (including Af-Warsangeli and Af-Dolbahaante), Af-Ogaadeen, Af-Degodia, Af-Wardeyg and Af-Marrehaan.
(3) The Lower Juba group: spoken by the part of the Northern Somali population which have immigrated into the Lower Juba region in the last 100/150 years. As this territory was a Benaadir-speaking area before the arrival of the immigrants from the north, the Nsom. of Lower Juba presents many peculiarities typical for the Benaadir dialects and could be considered a Benaadirized Nsom.
There you have it, the most proper and authentic form of Somali is Northern Somali. And the most proper and authentic form of Northern Somali is that spoken by Isaaq, Ciise, Gadaboursi and some Harti.
Here is the mapping of different Somali dialects:
The map legend says 'Nordsomali im eigentlichen sinne' in reference to Af Isaaq, Af Ciise and Af Gudabuursi which translates to:
'Northern Somali in the proper sense'. Dhulbahanta and Warsangali are included in the Darod dialectal group.
Although Lamberti conducted the most extensive research of anyone, he was not the only one to study Somali dialects. An earlier study was conducted in 1965 by John J. Pia of Indiana University.
He divided Somali dialects into four major dialect division:
(1) Isaaq Dialect
(2) Mudug Dialect
(3) Dir Dialect
(4) Benadir Dialect
John J. Pia described the Isaaq dialect as the dialect of most high prestige in Somali:
The Isaaq dialect of Somali being the most authentic is not up for debate.
Hope that satisfies your curiosity. Try not to make a fool of yourself again.
So ,these white so-called scholars' words are final and authentic ?
This is most pathetic thing about Iidoor .They take it for granted everything written by a white man .That's perhaps the worst form of inferiority complex .Everything they wrote is pure trash that holds little or no legitimacy over the topic in hand .
Don't impose this scholastic disaster on us .
It is widely accepted thing that greatest artistic form of any language is it is fascinating poetry .In this regard ,Ogaden comes head and shoulder above anyone else .It is widely known Ogaden from Hawd ,Ciid and Dollo produced the most notable poets in Somali history .Followed by Iidoor from Hawd and parts of Cayn and the Dhulbahante .
How on earth do you take serious someone talking of Afgduursi ,af-iidoor etc.That's is the stupidest comeback I ever seen from you Iindeed,much worser than your pointless name calling antics .
I say it again ,there is nothing called a standard Somali and there is nothing called clan based dielects like those mentioned by your 'divine' white scholars that you look up to in your whole 'academic' debates .
Ree Hawd and Ree Cideed speak the best Somali and of course thats the land of poets and fluency but it doesn't amount their Somali is standard.
Lastly, your so-called academics ignored the obvious fact that western Somali (Ogaden region)is too big to be generalized and it has its many dialects .In short ,what they wrote is shambolic and incoherent piece of academic disaster .Not because they are white and they speak good English will make their poor work sound and reliable .
You wrote an essay above just to save face after getting humiliated, and what do you base your garbage on? Did you quote any unbiased established academic sources? No. Did you present any evidence of whatever it is you are trying to say? No. Just pulling shit out of your arse and hoping no one would notice you got schooled above.
The fact that:
1) You were not aware of any research that was done on the subject of Somali dialects (yet still wanted to partake in this discussion) and;
2) You still refuse to acknowledge your jaahilnimo, trying to continue the argument despite conclusive evidence refuting your garbage;
Paints a clear picture of a jaahil cagdheer (true to the name) who wants to argue for the sake of arguing.
There is no cure for retardation. The term "doqonkii Cagdheer" was absolutely prophetic.
Be gone cagdheer, you are an halfwit with an internet connection.
There is no such thing as Af Isaaq, Dhulbahante, Issa or Gadabursi. Anything whites enter in their diaries doesn't mean it's a holy fact. Waxad iska maqashen "source".
There is only northern, central and southern dialects.
The Ogaden in K5 in the vast majority speak same dialbutect as reer Waqooyi folks. There few exclusive words for them but that's normal, you can even find that difference
You can pick small accent with Djibouti, Awdal and Jigjiga area but they are generally one northern dialect.
In all honesty Ogaden is great contributor to the suugaan and along with Isaaq and Dhulbahante are most prominent poet nation.
Don't you guys get sick of fadhi ku dirir?
Poor Bendover gets utterly frustrated .Your gibberish and womenish words absolutely mean nothing to me .It just shows how stupid you areI would rather take the word of esteemed scholars who spent years studying languages and dialects and actually conducting extensive research and field-work than a random drooling cagdheer on an internet forum. It is unfortunate that you've not had the chance to get a good education, you clearly do not comprehend academic methodology.
So ,these white so-called scholars' words are final and authentic ?
This is most pathetic thing about Iidoor .They take it for granted everything written by a white man .That's perhaps the worst form of inferiority complex .Everything they wrote is pure trash that holds little or no legitimacy over the topic in hand .
Don't impose this scholastic disaster on us .
It is widely accepted thing that greatest artistic form of any language is it is fascinating poetry .In this regard ,Ogaden comes head and shoulder above anyone else .It is widely known Ogaden from Hawd ,Ciid and Dollo produced the most notable poets in Somali history .Followed by Iidoor from Hawd and parts of Cayn and the Dhulbahante .
How on earth do you take serious someone talking of Afgduursi ,af-iidoor etc.That's is the stupidest comeback I ever seen from you Iindeed,much worser than your pointless name calling antics .
I say it again ,there is nothing called a standard Somali and there is nothing called clan based dielects like those mentioned by your 'divine' white scholars that you look up to in your whole 'academic' debates .
Ree Hawd and Ree Cideed speak the best Somali and of course thats the land of poets and fluency but it doesn't amount their Somali is standard.
Lastly, your so-called academics ignored the obvious fact that western Somali (Ogaden region)is too big to be generalized and it has its many dialects .In short ,what they wrote is shambolic and incoherent piece of academic disaster .Not because they are white and they speak good English will make their poor work sound and reliable .
You wrote an essay above just to save face after getting humiliated, and what do you base your garbage on? Did you quote any unbiased established academic sources? No. Did you present any evidence of whatever it is you are trying to say? No. Just pulling shit out of your arse and hoping no one would notice you got schooled above.
The fact that:
1) You were not aware of any research that was done on the subject of Somali dialects (yet still wanted to partake in this discussion) and;
2) You still refuse to acknowledge your jaahilnimo, trying to continue the argument despite conclusive evidence refuting your garbage;
Paints a clear picture of a jaahil cagdheer (true to the name) who wants to argue for the sake of arguing.
There is no cure for retardation. The term "doqonkii Cagdheer" was absolutely prophetic.
Be gone cagdheer, you are an halfwit with an internet connection.
And yeah ,I might not get the best of education and I may not write the best of the Queen's language but I still make more sense with my sound arguments than you .I don't worship the white man and believe all they write as an ultimate truth .That's just it.
Here we go again, you belief ,these whites guys did all the necessary measures and travelled through the lands mastering and comparing the various Somali dielects? And their work is nothing but a Quran for you ? Wow just wow! That alone speaks volume of your inherent inferiority complex
By the way ,what they wrote is utter gibberish and despicable piece of scholastic calamity because ,many like you will end up believing the whole nonsense thing they wrote .
It is not only me, people don't agree with laughable work of your so called scholars .
You're the one who's aware of a research done on Somali dielects but sadly you presented the worst written piece of shit ? I know a lot about Somali culture ,poetry and dialects as well .I am 100% sure I know a lot about the rich Somali dielects than your 'divine " white scholars who ,according to you , travelled through the expansive Somali territories ,then mastered the Somali dielect with it is many variations ,analyzed things and worked out to produce one gigantic ,infallible and authoritative piece of work .I for sure, can put to shame those so called scholars when it comes to Somali society1) You were not aware of any research that was done on the subject of Somali dialects (yet still wanted to partake in this discussion)
In fact your white godfathers got this one wrong .Their Jaahilnmo about the topic is just amazing .They did no proper research to come up with sound conclusive evidences .Sorry to offend you ,but this time your divine white scholars lost credibility regarding Somali dielects and actually their work is such a horrible mess.2) You still refuse to acknowledge your jaahilnimo, trying to continue the argument despite conclusive evidence refuting your garbage;
Cheap name calling antics .Your clan bla bla .Poor Bendover gets utterly frustrated .Your gibberish and womenish words absolutely mean nothing to me .It just shows how stupid you are
I would rather take the word of esteemed scholars who spent years studying languages and dialects and actually conducting extensive research and field-work than a random drooling cagdheer on an internet forum. It is unfortunate that you've not had the chance to get a good education, you clearly do not comprehend academic methodology.
You wrote an essay above just to save face after getting humiliated, and what do you base your garbage on? Did you quote any unbiased established academic sources? No. Did you present any evidence of whatever it is you are trying to say? No. Just pulling shit out of your arse and hoping no one would notice you got schooled above.
The fact that:
1) You were not aware of any research that was done on the subject of Somali dialects (yet still wanted to partake in this discussion) and;
2) You still refuse to acknowledge your jaahilnimo, trying to continue the argument despite conclusive evidence refuting your garbage;
Paints a clear picture of a jaahil cagdheer (true to the name) who wants to argue for the sake of arguing.
There is no cure for retardation. The term "doqonkii Cagdheer" was absolutely prophetic.
Be gone cagdheer, you are an halfwit with an internet connection.
And yeah ,I might not get the best of education and I may not write the best of the Queen's language but I still make more sense with my sound arguments than you .I don't worship the white man and believe all they write as an ultimate truth .That's just it.
Here we go again, you belief ,these whites guys did all the necessary measures and travelled through the lands mastering and comparing the various Somali dielects? And their work is nothing but a Quran for you ? Wow just wow! That alone speaks volume of your inherent inferiority complex
By the way ,what they wrote is utter gibberish and despicable piece of scholastic calamity because ,many like you will end up believing the whole nonsense thing they wrote .
It is not only me, people don't agree with laughable work of your so called scholars .
People describe your clan as 'a nations of halfwits', some call them retards, simpletons... you embody all those attributes. You actually think you can continue to argue despite not reading a single word of scholarship on the subject.
You can not be that stupid, you know what just happened in this thread.
Your argument is dead. Let this be a lesson.
I did not present "the worst written piece of shit", I quoted the single most extensive research work done on the subject of Somali dialects, spanning years of actual field-work on the ground. I dare you to prove otherwise.You're the one who's aware of a research done on Somali dielects but sadly you presented the worst written piece of shit ? I know a lot about Somali culture ,poetry and dialects as well .I am 100% sure I know a lot about the rich Somali dielects than your 'divine " white scholars who ,according to you , travelled through the expansive Somali territories ,then mastered the Somali dielect with it is many variations ,analyzed things and worked out to produce one gigantic ,infallible and authoritative piece of work .I for sure, can put to shame those so called scholars when it comes to Somali society1) You were not aware of any research that was done on the subject of Somali dialects (yet still wanted to partake in this discussion)
In fact your white godfathers got this one wrong .Their Jaahilnmo about the topic is just amazing .They did no proper research to come up with sound conclusive evidences .Sorry to offend you ,but this time your divine white scholars lost credibility regarding Somali dielects and actually their work is such a horrible mess.2) You still refuse to acknowledge your jaahilnimo, trying to continue the argument despite conclusive evidence refuting your garbage;
Bestpay
Your personal essay will carry no weight over scholarly produced evidence which is what Ben is doing. As evident in this cyber trolling( Snet) space anybody can claim anything or say what he/she wants to and present as truth but to academically debate with someone your viewpoints must be backed by credible evidence.
On the other hand, if you watch the bellow YouTube recording ( start from minute 41 onwards), its obvious this claim of Ciid and Hawd being the zone where the proper Somali spoken is something that Idaajaa spreads.
Whether you, an anonymous drooling cagdheer, who by his own admission is not well-educated, agree with their conclusion or not is beside the point. These are professionally trained scholars, who have spent years studying the science of language and dialects across multiple languages. Their work is peer-reviewed by other experts before publication. It has nothing to do with them being white. But you have nothing else to talk about.I did not present "the worst written piece of shit", I quoted the single most extensive research work done on the subject of Somali dialects, spanning years of actual field-work on the ground. I dare you to prove otherwise.You're the one who's aware of a research done on Somali dielects but sadly you presented the worst written piece of shit ? I know a lot about Somali culture ,poetry and dialects as well .I am 100% sure I know a lot about the rich Somali dielects than your 'divine " white scholars who ,according to you , travelled through the expansive Somali territories ,then mastered the Somali dielect with it is many variations ,analyzed things and worked out to produce one gigantic ,infallible and authoritative piece of work .I for sure, can put to shame those so called scholars when it comes to Somali society1) You were not aware of any research that was done on the subject of Somali dialects (yet still wanted to partake in this discussion)
The fact that you are not aware of research done on the subject, yet continue to argue from a place of ignorance, is a testament to your clear and utter jaahilnimo.
In fact your white godfathers got this one wrong .Their Jaahilnmo about the topic is just amazing .They did no proper research to come up with sound conclusive evidences .Sorry to offend you ,but this time your divine white scholars lost credibility regarding Somali dielects and actually their work is such a horrible mess.2) You still refuse to acknowledge your jaahilnimo, trying to continue the argument despite conclusive evidence refuting your garbage;
No one is interested in the opinion of a drooling jaahil cagdheer. You actually admitted to not being educated, yet somehow think its ok to still argue against consensus of scholarshipYou're miserably repeating yourself like a broken record .
You may believe in all that's said by a white scholar and use to to satisfy your delusional state of mind but the obvious fact is that they messed up things regarding Somali dialect .
Somali dialects are best classified according to geographical zones not based on clans .The undeniable truth is , Ree Hawd ,Doollo and Ciid has great dialects that dwarf all the rest .
One should consider in the first place , the dielects that dominate the poetry and other folklore songs that forms the basis of the rich linguistic history of any language.
Af-gudbursi AF iidoor etc is just a nonsese and only a certified dimwit will ascribe to such a thing
Bestpay
Your personal essay will carry no weight over scholarly produced evidence which is what Ben is doing. As evident in this cyber trolling( Snet) space anybody can claim anything or say what he/she wants to and present as truth but to academically debate with someone your viewpoints must be backed by credible evidence.
On the other hand, if you watch the bellow YouTube recording ( start from minute 41 onwards), its obvious this claim of Ciid and Hawd being the zone where the proper Somali spoken is something that Idaajaa spreads.
Look at this stupid Iidoor troll.
Hawd is not just one piece of confined Territory occupied one certain clan .It a massive land that runs forms Cayn all the way to Aware and beyond .It is co-inhabited by three major clans ;Ogaden ,Iidoor and Dhulbante .Along with Doollo, 90% of Somali Suugaan originated from these two regions .Those three clans not only fought for wells and pastureland but also linguistic prowess ,to this date ,the greatest number of living Somali poets come from these regions all ascribing to one of the three said clans .
My one and only point is , there's nothing like clan specific clan dialects it varies with region and neighborhoods .And when it comes to Somali language superiority , the land of poets should come first ! Not so called fake scholastic stuff written by a foreigners who has little grasp of our rich language .
What evidence did your master troll pulled out so far ? How's that scholastic ? Do you just blindly believe anything written on a paper without first confirming it is authenticity ?Bestpay
Your personal essay will carry no weight over scholarly produced evidence which is what Ben is doing. As evident in this cyber trolling( Snet) space anybody can claim anything or say what he/she wants to and present as truth but to academically debate with someone your viewpoints must be backed by credible evidence.
On the other hand, if you watch the bellow YouTube recording ( start from minute 41 onwards), its obvious this claim of Ciid and Hawd being the zone where the proper Somali spoken is something that Idaajaa spreads.
Look at this stupid Iidoor troll.
Hawd is not just one piece of confined Territory occupied one certain clan .It a massive land that runs forms Cayn all the way to Aware and beyond .It is co-inhabited by three major clans ;Ogaden ,Iidoor and Dhulbante .Along with Doollo, 90% of Somali Suugaan originated from these two regions .Those three clans not only fought for wells and pastureland but also linguistic prowess ,to this date ,the greatest number of living Somali poets come from these regions all ascribing to one of the three said clans .
My one and only point is , there's nothing like clan specific clan dialects it varies with region and neighborhoods .And when it comes to Somali language superiority , the land of poets should come first ! Not so called fake scholastic stuff written by a foreigners who has little grasp of our rich language .
Don't provoke me by calling stupid, I am not in the mood of derailing the topic. I was merely helping you out into bringing evidence into the discussion. No sane person would accept biased and unsubstantiated opinion over scholarly written stuff.
What evidence did your master troll pulled out so far ? How's that scholastic ? Do you just blindly believe anything written on a paper without first confirming it is authenticity ?
Look at this stupid Iidoor troll.
Hawd is not just one piece of confined Territory occupied one certain clan .It a massive land that runs forms Cayn all the way to Aware and beyond .It is co-inhabited by three major clans ;Ogaden ,Iidoor and Dhulbante .Along with Doollo, 90% of Somali Suugaan originated from these two regions .Those three clans not only fought for wells and pastureland but also linguistic prowess ,to this date ,the greatest number of living Somali poets come from these regions all ascribing to one of the three said clans .
My one and only point is , there's nothing like clan specific clan dialects it varies with region and neighborhoods .And when it comes to Somali language superiority , the land of poets should come first ! Not so called fake scholastic stuff written by a foreigners who has little grasp of our rich language .
Don't provoke me by calling stupid, I am not in the mood of derailing the topic. I was merely helping you out into bringing evidence into the discussion. No sane person would accept biased and unsubstantiated opinion over scholarly written stuff.
What do you think is authentic about the so called evidence of bendover ? Or you're just another emotional iidoor motherfuker who is just trolling around ?
The evidence is quite obvious .The Somali literary work on dhaqan and suugan emanates from those two regions .The land of poets comes superior to all other dialects .If you wish I can provide hundreds of masterpiece poems who form the threshold of Somali poetry coming from the said regions .That is one massive evidence I have for you unless you want some bogus mess written by a white guy. Are you getting me sir ?What Ben says has no bearing on your argument, you are the one arguing Ciid and Hawd are the hot spot of the proper Somali zone so you should bring your own evidence proofing that claim.
Ben is definitely wrong and everything presented can't serve as evidence .what if my personal essays debunks the the works written by the so called scholars ?
I am not saying Ben is right or wrong, the point is, he presented something as an evidence whether that is believable or not is for the readers to decide but presenting your own personal essay as evidence will change nothing.
And you iidoors cross the deadly Mediterranean sea just see and interact your divine gods ,the white men .In fact , Iidoors are suffering from the worst kind of inferiority complex .The horde of cowards who lack mental capacity are iidoors .the dreamers of never coming event .the ictraaf .the lunatics who are not even taken serious by other Somalis .The evil sons of Bucur Bucayr .Iidoor are a lot more worser than any other Somali clan .
You Cagdheers lack the metal capacity to evolve even if your tribe was exposed (through the airlifting of entire Cagdheer tribesmen in the refugee camps of Kenya to north America) to the civilized world
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