SomaliNet Forums

Lately I've been seeing some calls for war against PL, as if that will go well. Some people actually believe the FGS is capable of subduing Puntland by means of force.

Some points to be considered;

1. After Siad Barre finished the cracking down on the insurgency waged by SSDF forces, he offered Majeerteen various positions in the Kacaan government and made sure to provide financial incentive for their support, this is what we call APPEASEMENT. Most clans did not get to have this opportunity, if at all.

2. Majeerteen control 1500km² of Somaliweyne, while the Hawiye and Isaaq were engaged in clan wars, Majeerteen stabilized legitimate authority by propping up government institutions at the local and national level, this is what we call political MATURITY.

3. You cannot simply destroy MJ and have them be subservient, you never will. Aideed the kingpin of Hawiye failed in his endeavours, even if it did result in a 'victory', that victory would eventually result in a TOTAL loss and the consequences would be dire ie back to square one (1991). "Victory” is not a military, but a political concept. More simply put, war is the continuation of politics by other means.

4. One of the definitions of 'power' is the capacity or ability to direct or influence the behaviour of others or the course of events. What other word can be best attributed to the Majeerteen clan? With the advent of the Somali republic the Majeerteen clan have always played a prominent role, from prime minister then president Abdirashid Ali Sharmarke, Hagi Mohammed Liban designing the flag of Somalia in 1954, Osman Yusuf Kenadid pioneering the first Somali script (Osmanya), Somali Youth League (SYL), Ogaden war to serving as the precursors to the very same federal system that gave rise to Galmudug, Jubaland, Hirshabelle and other states.

5. Without Majeerteen Somalia is nothing, starting a war would be a fools gambit, there's a reason why MJ is a household name. You will never hear another Darood clan receive as much hatred and vitriol - as well as admiration and respect - from Hargesia all the way to Nairobi. At the end of the day it's just politics, Farmaajo needs to remain patient, a war will only galvanise support for Deni and cement his position. This is for those braying for war, isqabooji and let Farmaajo and Deni resolve this political deadlock.

4.5 has made MX and MJ political rivals

The only reason the rebel movements in the 1980's were able to function was because they were heavily funded and supported by outside forces. Ethiopia, Djibouti, Yemen, Libya, Soviet Union, Kenya, Cuba, etc played key roles in providing logistics, weapons and funding with any and all rebel movements that were against the Kacaan government.

The Soviet Union collapsed. Ethiopia has had change of governments. Yemen in in total disarray. Libya is somewhere in Akhira. If Somalia's current and future government(s) creates a diplomatic relationships with Ethiopia, Kenya, Djibouti, UAE, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Egypt and other foreign nations, then I'm quite sure not a single Somali clan will be able to take up arms against the Somali government. Without assistance, no funding, no logistics and no support of any kind, any and all Somali clans will be incapable to start a rebellion against a Somali government that is internationally supported by most major powers of today's era.

I genuinely believe this is what Farmaajo's administration is working on. Disconnect all individual connections Somali clans have with outside influences by creating a long-lasting, friendly and diplomatic ties with foreign nations that have been dealing directly with individual Somali clans and thus disabling the breastfeeding that has been going on for three to four decades once and for all between Somali clans and foreign entities.

Phinks,

I have no issues with average MJ shacbi, they are no different than any other Somalis. The MJ political establishment though, still operates on SSDF ideology, mindset. Which is basically if we're not leading the Government, do whatever could possibly be done, working with whatever destabilizing elements they need to work with to gain an advance until they lead again. Whether its Italians, Ethiopia mid 2000s, UAE, Kenya today, it doesn't matter. Say what you want about MX, you never hear them say "We don't recognize the Government, we don't recognize the Government" doesn't matter if we're leading or not.

You said something about people are encouraging fighting them, I'm not sure who's advocated for that. The best approach is what Farmaajo has done the past few years, simply ignore them which ironically infuriates them more than if he didn't.

Don’t people lie to you majerteen and marexaan are brothers. The only beef is who is going to lead the country. Like many others family intermarriages till today is also very strong. The competition is about power not hatred.

Phinks,

I have no issues with average MJ shacbi, they are no different than any other Somalis. The MJ political establishment though, still operates on SSDF ideology, mindset. Which is basically if we're not leading the Government, do whatever could possibly be done, working with whatever destabilizing elements they need to work with to gain an advance until they lead again. Whether its Italians, Ethiopia mid 2000s, UAE, Kenya today, it doesn't matter. Say what you want about MX, you never hear them say "We don't recognize the Government, we don't recognize the Government" doesn't matter if we're leading or not.

You said something about people are encouraging fighting them, I'm not sure who's advocated for that. The best approach is what Farmaajo has done the past few years, simply ignore them which ironically infuriates them more than if he didn't.

Best summation really

Don’t people lie to you majerteen and marexaan are brothers. The only beef is who is going to lead the country. Like many others family intermarriages till today is also very strong. The competition is about power not hatred.

Are you saying the rivalry isn't as bad as it sounds across this forum?

I will be honest with you, we are not against farmaajo. We just want our piece of the PIE. Farmaajo was rather well prepared in that he started rebuilding the military unlike his predecessors who relied heavily on Amisom. In a way you can also make the argument that this was a process that was started by his predecessors and he made vast gains in 4 years. SNA is the strongest it has been in years. It needs to be inclusive and not to be used as a political tool.

The only reason the rebel movements in the 1980's were able to function was because they were heavily funded and supported by outside forces. Ethiopia, Djibouti, Yemen, Libya, Soviet Union, Kenya, Cuba, etc played key roles in providing logistics, weapons and funding with any and all rebel movements that were against the Kacaan government.

The Soviet Union collapsed. Ethiopia has had change of governments. Yemen in in total disarray. Libya is somewhere in Akhira. If Somalia's current and future government(s) creates a diplomatic relationships with Ethiopia, Kenya, Djibouti, UAE, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Egypt and other foreign nations, then I'm quite sure not a single Somali clan will be able to take up arms against the Somali government. Without assistance, no funding, no logistics and no support of any kind, any and all Somali clans will be incapable to start a rebellion against a Somali government that is internationally supported by most major powers of today's era.

I genuinely believe this is what Farmaajo's administration is working on. Disconnect all individual connections Somali clans have with outside influences by creating a long-lasting, friendly and diplomatic ties with foreign nations that have been dealing directly with individual Somali clans and thus disabling the breastfeeding that has been going on for three to four decades once and for all between Somali clans and foreign entities.

You obviously swallowed the entire propaganda peddled by the Barre regime. We will be more than happy to meet you under any field or town, and see if it was all actually down to outside forces doing the heavy lifting.

Also you fail to lock in the mirror and see who is actually being assisted today. You are being probed up like a patient learning to walk again by the international community. Making all these absurd demands to other nations will come at a cost. Your uncle gave up the Ogaden I order to encourage Ethiopia to assist him by kicking the SNM out. What will Farmaajo give up?

The only reason the rebel movements in the 1980's were able to function was because they were heavily funded and supported by outside forces. Ethiopia, Djibouti, Yemen, Libya, Soviet Union, Kenya, Cuba, etc played key roles in providing logistics, weapons and funding with any and all rebel movements that were against the Kacaan government.

The Soviet Union collapsed. Ethiopia has had change of governments. Yemen in in total disarray. Libya is somewhere in Akhira. If Somalia's current and future government(s) creates a diplomatic relationships with Ethiopia, Kenya, Djibouti, UAE, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Egypt and other foreign nations, then I'm quite sure not a single Somali clan will be able to take up arms against the Somali government. Without assistance, no funding, no logistics and no support of any kind, any and all Somali clans will be incapable to start a rebellion against a Somali government that is internationally supported by most major powers of today's era.

I genuinely believe this is what Farmaajo's administration is working on. Disconnect all individual connections Somali clans have with outside influences by creating a long-lasting, friendly and diplomatic ties with foreign nations that have been dealing directly with individual Somali clans and thus disabling the breastfeeding that has been going on for three to four decades once and for all between Somali clans and foreign entities.

You obviously swallowed the entire propaganda peddled by the Barre regime. We will be more than happy to meet you under any field or town, and see if it was all actually down to outside forces doing the heavy lifting.

Also you fail to lock in the mirror and see who is actually being assisted today. You are being probed up like a patient learning to walk again by the international community. Making all these absurd demands to other nations will come at a cost. Your uncle gave up the Ogaden I order to encourage Ethiopia to assist him by kicking the SNM out. What will Farmaajo give up?

Are you suggesting that NO single Somali rebel group was ever supported in any way by foreign entities in the 1980's and forth?

The only reason the rebel movements in the 1980's were able to function was because they were heavily funded and supported by outside forces. Ethiopia, Djibouti, Yemen, Libya, Soviet Union, Kenya, Cuba, etc played key roles in providing logistics, weapons and funding with any and all rebel movements that were against the Kacaan government.

The Soviet Union collapsed. Ethiopia has had change of governments. Yemen in in total disarray. Libya is somewhere in Akhira. If Somalia's current and future government(s) creates a diplomatic relationships with Ethiopia, Kenya, Djibouti, UAE, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Egypt and other foreign nations, then I'm quite sure not a single Somali clan will be able to take up arms against the Somali government. Without assistance, no funding, no logistics and no support of any kind, any and all Somali clans will be incapable to start a rebellion against a Somali government that is internationally supported by most major powers of today's era.

I genuinely believe this is what Farmaajo's administration is working on. Disconnect all individual connections Somali clans have with outside influences by creating a long-lasting, friendly and diplomatic ties with foreign nations that have been dealing directly with individual Somali clans and thus disabling the breastfeeding that has been going on for three to four decades once and for all between Somali clans and foreign entities.

You obviously swallowed the entire propaganda peddled by the Barre regime. We will be more than happy to meet you under any field or town, and see if it was all actually down to outside forces doing the heavy lifting.

Also you fail to lock in the mirror and see who is actually being assisted today. You are being probed up like a patient learning to walk again by the international community. Making all these absurd demands to other nations will come at a cost. Your uncle gave up the Ogaden I order to encourage Ethiopia to assist him by kicking the SNM out. What will Farmaajo give up?

Are you suggesting that NO single Somali rebel group was ever supported in any way by foreign entities in the 1980's and forth?

Unless you mean to tell me the Barre regime was making all those bullets it was using against innocent civilians, the we can agree everybody was supported by foreign entities. Why are the rebels singled out when the fact is the Barre regime was dependent on these same handouts more than the rebels themselves.

You obviously swallowed the entire propaganda peddled by the Barre regime. We will be more than happy to meet you under any field or town, and see if it was all actually down to outside forces doing the heavy lifting.

Also you fail to lock in the mirror and see who is actually being assisted today. You are being probed up like a patient learning to walk again by the international community. Making all these absurd demands to other nations will come at a cost. Your uncle gave up the Ogaden I order to encourage Ethiopia to assist him by kicking the SNM out. What will Farmaajo give up?

Are you suggesting that NO single Somali rebel group was ever supported in any way by foreign entities in the 1980's and forth?

Unless you mean to tell me the Barre regime was making all those bullets it was using against innocent civilians, the we can agree everybody was supported by foreign entities. Why are the rebels singled out when the fact is the Barre regime was dependent on these same handouts more than the rebels themselves.

No. Siyaad Barre's government was the sole, legitimate government in place at the time. They were buying weapons legally. The rebels in the other hand were clandestinely being supported. That's the difference. The governments that were supporting the rebels were an enemy to Siyaad Barre's government. The governments that were selling weapons to Siyaad Barre's government were simply making money. They couldn't give a shit who won. It was all politics in the end of the day.

Are you suggesting that NO single Somali rebel group was ever supported in any way by foreign entities in the 1980's and forth?

Unless you mean to tell me the Barre regime was making all those bullets it was using against innocent civilians, the we can agree everybody was supported by foreign entities. Why are the rebels singled out when the fact is the Barre regime was dependent on these same handouts more than the rebels themselves.

No. Siyaad Barre's government was the sole, legitimate government in place at the time. They were buying weapons legally. The rebels in the other hand were clandestinely being supported. That's the difference. The governments that were supporting the rebels were an enemy to Siyaad Barre's government. The governments that were selling weapons to Siyaad Barre's government were simply making money. They couldn't give a shit who won. It was all politics in the end of the day.

I’m confused with the acrobatic you’re conducted in explaining;

If your whole argument is based around; the rebels are wrong for asking assistance, instead they should have stayed put and allowed the government soldiers kill them. You need to go back to school.

Unless you mean to tell me the Barre regime was making all those bullets it was using against innocent civilians, the we can agree everybody was supported by foreign entities. Why are the rebels singled out when the fact is the Barre regime was dependent on these same handouts more than the rebels themselves.

No. Siyaad Barre's government was the sole, legitimate government in place at the time. They were buying weapons legally. The rebels in the other hand were clandestinely being supported. That's the difference. The governments that were supporting the rebels were an enemy to Siyaad Barre's government. The governments that were selling weapons to Siyaad Barre's government were simply making money. They couldn't give a shit who won. It was all politics in the end of the day.

I’m confused with the acrobatic you’re conducted in explaining;

If your whole argument is based around; the rebels are wrong for asking assistance, instead they should have stayed put and allowed the government soldiers kill them. You need to go back to school.

Where have I ever said "the rebels are wrong for asking assistance?" My argument was never about who was right or who was wrong. I think you totally misunderstood my point. Allow me to reiterate my point.

if a strong Somali government has full support from powerful nations and it also has diplomatic relations with neighboring countries like Ethiopia, Djibouti, Kenya, Arab league, etc, then it would be difficult for any Somali clan to form a rebel movement. The only way most Somali clans were able to form rebel movements in the 1980's was due to Somalia's diplomatic fallout with the Soviet Union and her allies. Somalia's neighbors were supporting Somali rebels regardless of what clan the rebels were representing. This created a means for the rebels to challenge Somalia's government in the 1980s.

They hijacked the topic again.