Leaving ISLAM......

[Knight of Wisdom]

What is the rules against a person that leaves ISLAM?

Personally, I think anyone has the right to leave Islam and that no one should be killed for simply saying that they have left ISLAM, since it's their life and choice. Also, there was this Hadith, where Companions of the Prophet, who were fighting against the Byzantine Empire in Sham, walked by a TOWN, and saw a guy who was part of the Companions in a previous Mission To Seize Constantinople, but decided to leave Islam and convert to Christianity due to a Christian female he fall in love with and she told him to convert to Christianity if he wants to marry her. But, the Muslim Army didn't kill him, although they recognized him as Abdurahman the Christian !

So, what's the ruling against people that leave Islam?

[migdan]

What is the rules against a person that leaves ISLAM?

Personally, I think anyone has the right to leave Islam and that no one should be killed for simply saying that they have left ISLAM, since it's their life and choice. Also, there was this Hadith, where Companions of the Prophet, who were fighting against the Byzantine Empire in Sham, walked by a TOWN, and saw a guy who was part of the Companions in a previous Mission To Seize Constantinople, but decided to leave Islam and convert to Christianity due to a Christian female he fall in love with and she told him to convert to Christianity if he wants to marry her.

So, what's the ruling against people that leave Islam?

The Koran only states punshment for apostates in the hereafter. It doesn't state that the death penalty be used in this life. However, people have their own interpretation of Islam and do whatever they think is what God "wants". If God wanted it, he would state it in his holy book.

“O ye who believe! Should any of you desert His religion, God will then raise up a people loved by Him, and loving Him.” (Quran 5:59)

[melo]

Ijmaa of 4 madhabs in Sunni Islam, is that apostacy is punishable by execution. The rationale behind this, is that if you allow apostates to become apostates, this will lead to a moral degradation of society- fitnah, which is worse than than slaughter. Ive heard some contemporary sheikhs saying that peaceful apostates should be allowed to live, if they dont try and corrupt society. They back this up with one hadith, that ties apostacy in, with fighting against the community. This opinion however goes against the grain of Islamic thought. Most scholars of tradition do not accept this.

[melo]

I've also heard that the Amir can exile the person, if he chooses too. This is to prevent his fitnah manifesting itself in society.

[SultanOrder]

Islam is more than a "religion" it is a social contract. One enters the social contract voluntarily hence "no compulsion in religion", but once entering into that social contract it becomes incumbent on protecting the body politc so that it remains. If you read about western political thinkers, you will see a lot of them believe that once you enter into this socio-politc than you are in it forever and your offspring, and leaving it is equated to treason, which the punishment is death, or exile.

[Knight of Wisdom]

Ijmaa of 4 madhabs in Sunni Islam, is that apostacy is punishable by execution. The rationale behind this, is that if you allow apostates to become apostates, this will lead to a moral degradation of society- fitnah, which is worse than than slaughter. Ive heard some contemporary sheikhs saying that peaceful apostates should be allowed to live, if they dont try and corrupt society. They back this up with one hadith, that ties apostacy in, with fighting against the community. This opinion however goes against the grain of Islamic thought. Most scholars of tradition do not accept this.

Doesn't that completely contradicts the "freedom of religion" in Islam? If one leaves Islam, without insulting it or harming it, by simply converting to another faith peacefully, would that individual still be killed?

[Knight of Wisdom]

Islam is more than a "religion" it is a social contract. One enters the social contract voluntarily hence "no compulsion in religion", but once entering into that social contract it becomes incumbent on protecting the body politc so that it remains. If you read about western political thinkers, you will see a lot of them believe that once you enter into this socio-politc than you are in it forever and your offspring, and leaving it is equated to treason, which the punishment is death, or exile.

Others have said that in the Quran there is a verse that states "No compulsion in religion". That verse isn't only talking about coming into the religion of Islam voluntarily, but it also talks about not having any repercussions for leaving Islam.

[melo]

Ijmaa of 4 madhabs in Sunni Islam, is that apostacy is punishable by execution. The rationale behind this, is that if you allow apostates to become apostates, this will lead to a moral degradation of society- fitnah, which is worse than than slaughter. Ive heard some contemporary sheikhs saying that peaceful apostates should be allowed to live, if they dont try and corrupt society. They back this up with one hadith, that ties apostacy in, with fighting against the community. This opinion however goes against the grain of Islamic thought. Most scholars of tradition do not accept this.

Doesn't that completely contradicts the "freedom of religion" in Islam? If one leaves Islam, without insulting it or harming it, by simply converting to another faith peacefully, would that individual still be killed?

As perefect order wrote, in an Islamic state, apostacy equates to high treason. This is because of the dangers of apostacy (and saying publicly you are an apostacy) on the poltiical apratus. If you allow people to come out with their apostacy, then it will lead to the eventual degradation of society.

If one wants to apostate, he/she should keep it silent. But if it is brought out into the public, then the leader will have to do something.

Ive heard this creates a nation of munaafiqs. However, the state does not really judge on the internal state of people. If one wants to be a munaafiq, claiming to be a muslim but apostatizing, then that is up to him/her. He/she should not be allowed to promote or expose their apostasy. He can take himself to hell fire, but stay away from corrupting society

[migdan]

Islam is more than a "religion" it is a social contract. One enters the social contract voluntarily hence "no compulsion in religion", but once entering into that social contract it becomes incumbent on protecting the body politc so that it remains. If you read about western political thinkers, you will see a lot of them believe that once you enter into this socio-politc than you are in it forever and your offspring, and leaving it is equated to treason, which the punishment is death, or exile.

Others have said that in the Quran there is a verse that states "No compulsion in religion". That verse isn't only talking about coming into the religion of Islam voluntarily, but it also talks about not having any repercussions for leaving Islam.

lol. questioning its validity? its o.k. people do it more often than you think. however, don't express your opinion here as you might get banned for doing so.

[Knight of Wisdom]

But, isn't a Munafiq more worse than an Apostate, since a Apostate publicly notified the people that he/she is no longer a Muslim?

Also, the Apostasy have levels. The infamous Apostate named Ibn Arabi (The Sufi Poet), who said that "He is God and God is he", was put to death, because not only was he committing shirk, but he was deliberately teaching the young minds to speak in such ways. Mind you, he never claimed that he left Islam, but the mere fact that he was standing firm to his path, despite the fact that he was told over and over to stop his ill-fated teaching got him under the sword.

So, if Apostasy has levels, then why kill a person who peacefully left Islam?


Why should I get banned when I'm trying to inquire knowledge? I'm not stating my opinion, however thru my opinions and curiosity, I would gain knowledge insha'allah.

[bareento]

Some earlier Makka ayaats were subrogated: they were more accomodating for non muslims.
Its understandable as a time muslims were minority, it will be foolish to go around and declare killing all apostates!
Ayats from the madina epoch, when islam was on the rising tide replaced the makkaan ayaats

So before citing an ayaat, first check whether its abrogated or not!

Wats funny is the so called muslim moderate seem to champion the early makkan ayaats whereas the fanatics are fond of the madina ayaats!
personnaly I am confused as I believe that the fanatics I hate the most are more in line with the teachings of Islam!
In fact the perfect Islam in the horn is the one applied by ....shabaab

B.

[AhlulbaytSoldier]

Only the apostate who invites others to kufr must be killed. But the one who is no threat should be left alone. There is no compulsion in religion.

[Mondey]

an apostate is apostate whether good or bad and he shall be sentenced to death according to islam.

no one forced him to become a muslim in the first place. islam has NO WAY OUT.

[Voltage]

I understand the punishment to be what Hutuking described. If someone becomes an apostate, it is a matter between them and God. Only if the individual takes his/her apostasy public and causes social unrest, does the State get involved according to Islamic law.

[melo]

But, isn't a Munafiq more worse than an Apostate, since a Apostate publicly notified the people that he/she is no longer a Muslim?

Also, the Apostasy have levels. The infamous Apostate named Ibn Arabi (The Sufi Poet), who said that "He is God and God is he", was put to death, because not only was he committing shirk, but he was deliberately teaching the young minds to speak in such ways. Mind you, he never claimed that he left Islam, but the mere fact that he was standing firm to his path, despite the fact that he was told over and over to stop his ill-fated teaching got him under the sword.

So, if Apostasy has levels, then why kill a person who peacefully left Islam?


Why should I get banned when I'm trying to inquire knowledge? I'm not stating my opinion, however thru my opinions and curiosity, I would gain knowledge insha'allah.

The argument is that a peaceful apostate constitutes a threat. 1 peaceful apostate cant do anything, but if you give the space for people to publicly come out with their apostacy, then you might have a coaliation who might try and enforce their values, on the system. In essence, moral degradation of society.

Only god can judge your heart. Only god judges what you do privately. The state deals with the public.

Only if the individual takes his/her apostasy public and causes social unrest, does the State get involved according to Islamic law.

It depends on what you mean social unrest.. bringing your apostacy to public, almost gloating about it, could be considered as causing social unrest. But that would be considered "peaceful apostacy" by some. All up to interpretation you see..

Only the apostate who invites others to kufr must be killed. But the one who is no threat should be left alone. There is no compulsion in religion.

I think this isnt the traditional opinion, but its one that at least seems more in the spirit of Islam.